Calling Abu Dujanah

[UmmHabibah]

Assalam aleikum

Raydiya, I just posted the tafseer of the ayat by Ibn Qayyim. A good reminder for all muslims, wouldn't you agree?

And may Allah tala forgive all muslims ameen.

Sis Muslimah, I think the post of Abu Dujanah answered your question, no need for me to elaborate.

[Abu Dujanah]

Sister Radiyah,

I just asked a question to umm habibah becuase i come accross alot of apologists {espically in the west}......

Ukthee i think u misunderstood me....

[radiyah]

Sister Umhabibah, thanku for answering and sorry again if I misundersttod u.

Brother Abu, my apologies again for misunderstanding u.

And I hope Allah Almighty will forgive our ignorance and unite us to serve him only.

Wa salam 'alaykom wa rahmat Allah.

[Muslimah]

<i>Originally posted by Abu Dujanah </i>As salam alykom

what I am about to do is never my way but well I think I must:

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<b>We should not be so emotional. Isn't the condition for many of the expiations regarding \"freeing a slave\" that the slave be a Mu'min? Yes, it is permissible and good to free a Kaafir slave, but it is not the same reward nor value as freeing a Muslim.</b>

And even though it is good to free a Kaafir slave, then was this the Sunnah of the Prophet (Sallallaahu 3alayhi wa Sallam) and his companions -- I mean to free ALL the slaves? Didn't the Prophet (Sallallaahu 3alayhi wa Sallam) and his companions live and die owning slaves? No scholar nor Muslim holds them blameworthy due to this.

didn't the Messenger of Allah free around 100.000 war prisoners when he opened Mecca, while they could have been all slaves, they were all still kafirs?
 

Also, many of the scholars have spoken about the Mafaasid (harms) of dropping this Shar3. They mention, amongst many, adultery/fornication. How? Because people who don't have the means to marriage, but could instead fulfill their desires through slave girls, end up committing Zinaa. And because many people who need help in the house hire females to do the work, and commit Zinaa with them. If they had slave girls, it would be Halaal for them to have relations with them. These two harms were mentioned by Shaykh al-Albaanee in one of his tapes. Also, Muslimaat are worked out by the extensive amount of work they have at home, had they had slave girls in the house to help them, it would make their lives easier.

what did the Messenger of Allah (SAW) tell his daughter fatima when she went after one of his battles asking for a slave from among the sabaya to help her around the house work? he taught <span>to say sobhan Allah 33, Alhamdulelah 33 and Allahu Akbar 34 before she went to sleep, so we do the same</span>  

I want to add that its an attribute of the Taa'ifah al-Mansoorah to obtain its Rizq from its enemies. Rizq includes food, money, and women. This has been abondaned by many.

Rather than calling to the further decay of this Shar3, I really think one should be thankful to Allaah for this great Ni3mah and make Du3aa' that it is revived.

My point also is, don't think that freeing all Kaafirs until there is no more slavery is the Sunnah of the Prophet, Sallallaahu 3alayhi wa Sallam.

the difference we are talking about is that and I hope u really see the point this time, simply because I usually avoid arguing for the sake of Allah and following the Messenger's sunnah, is that slavery was there, Islam did not come to institute it or stress it, but rather to dry its sources. Allah by making many expiation of sin favorable to free a slave is certainly drying its source. Simply like polygyny. It was there, Allah regulated it only to 4 (I agree with u on this) it is not conditional. I dont want to go off topic.

wa Allah u a`alem

[Abu Dujanah]

Ya Allah.

[UmmHabibah]

Assalam aleikum

Sis Radiyah no need to apologise

Sis Muslimah, if i could ask you a question? Hypothetically, what if the khilafa is established and jihad is established. The Muslims are victorious and gain war booty. What are we to do with the prisoners of war and the women? Would it be halal to distribute them as slaves? And would that woman be halal for the muslim man who takes her?

Would the quran still apply? So many surahs talk of slave girls. Surah muminoon. One of many.

<b>...those who guard their modesty, except those joined to them in marriage bond or the (captives) whom their right hands possess. For in their case there is no blame...</b>

What are we to do with the words of Allah tala?

That is if Islam only came to dry the source as you mentioned. So when would this be applicable?

Please be careful what you say if you choose answer.

wa aleikum salam

[Muslimah]

<i>Originally posted by Abu Dujanah </i><b>Ya Allah. </b>

Just one more point, the quran does not specify if u have to free a kafir or Muslim slave in order to expiate of your sins.

and just now I realized that me, u and Umm habiba are not really talking on the same wave.

The point is not really being made.

Alhamdelah

no problem

[UmmHabibah]

Wa aleikum salam

just now I realized that me, u and Umm habiba are not really talking on the same wave.

No worries sister Muslimah.

Assalam aleikum

[Abu Dujanah]

I think the sincere scholars should write a book on this issue.

And maybe the title should be

Al-Qawl al-Muhtadd Fee Jawaaz Akhth Banaat al-Kaafir wal-Mushrik wal-Murtad

The Decisive and Final Say on the Permissability of taking the Daughters of the Disbeliever, Polythiest and Apostate

Or

Al-Burhaan as-SaaTi3 Fee Jawaazi Sabyi Banaat al-Kuffaar 3ind al-Shaari3

The Strong Proofs in the Permissibility of Enslaving the Disbelieving Women, according to The Legislator

[Muslimah]

as salam alykom

the problem is that both of u think that we are saying it is not permissible, we know it is, it is in Quran, we can not go against Quran. We only say that Islam came to dry the sources of slavery. I think I said this already three times before.

That is the difference. And Islam encourages people who already own slaves to free them. So that is the difference.

Alhamdulelah