Nun murdered in retaliation for what Pope said

[Muslimah]

Bismillah


quote name='Deen' date='Sep 19 2006, 07:31 PM' post='27296']


The questions is, who writes the speeches for the pope, himself?





as salam alykom


Good question Deen.

[AlShamms]

Peace.....


Muslimah, I am indeed aware at the peaceful relations the early church and the Coptics had with the adhirants to Islam. It wasn't until Constantine and the advent of Roman Catholicism that things began to go wrong....I also want to point out it was not only Jews and Muslims who suffered during the Spanish Inquisition, that those who were not aligned with Rome also met persicution. Now why they converted to Islam? Well I have an opinion on that:


(2 Timothy 4:1) I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;


(2 Timothy 4:2) Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.


(2 Timothy 4:3) For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;


(2 Timothy 4:4) And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.


Shamms

[Deen]

Bismillah


as salam alykom


Welcome back deen, pls check your pm, which are sitting there since a long time.

FYI - I have replied to your message.


Sorry for the delay, I hardly know how to use discussion forums (only know how to post messages and reply etc.)


Now I know, I will use it more often!


PS - You had me worried for a second when I read the title of the message.


Jazzakallah.

[LDSTexan]

I am glad that this man is condemned.


I don't know what to think about what the Pope said. I think, historically, and correct me if I am wrong...but Islam was largely spread by the sword. Not necessarily by compulsion, but by conquest. Did not Mohammed successor successfully take over much of the arab world by force?

Muhammed DID spread it by the sword. It was convert or die", and unfortunately the torch has been carried on till present day with Al Qaeda, etc. This was the same mentality that the Crusaders took to the Jews and Muslims. Kill the unbeliever. Satan is is such a liar as to twist doctrines as to allow a very shallow false justification for murder. I personally believe that the Crusaders were not inspired by God (but by Satan the Father of Lies) so I will never believe the argument that any religion has a God given right to compell conversion by force as it is against an eternal principle called "free agency" that even God respects. Where there is no choice there is no growth. Compulsion can never cause true conversion, and thus the taking of another's "free agency" is an abomination in the site of God and both groups Muslims/Christians have been guilty of it.


Here's a question. Why doesn't the Muslim world ever come out and condemn terrorist acts doen against non-muslims? The silence has me concerned. This world has gone mad. :banghead:

[LDSTexan]

Bismillah


as salam alykom


Welcome back deen, pls check your pm, which are sitting there since a long time.


now back to our core of interest. Not every situation appears in the manner you perceive it.


CC and Shamms, I m Egyptian living in Egypt among a Copt (Nasara who are called here as Orthodox). And of course you are aware that historically, Egypt was opened by the Muslim army at the time of Omar's reign. But let me explain and of course this in no way an under estimation to your knoweldge. Just bringing the info forward.


Are you aware that the Muslim army didnt move toward Egypt willingly, but rather Omar received an SOS from the Egyptian Coptic community who were under serious oppression by the Roman Catholics. They wanted to force them into abanding their sect as being Orthodox and join Catholisim by force. If u search Roman Emperors and a number of saints, you will come accross this fact. So Egyptian Copts were seriously oppressed, tortured, ..etc in order to join Catholisim. Knowing that Muslims dont force anyone into their faith, they sent for help from Omar. He sent an army headed by Amr Ibn Al A`as, who even tried his best to evade fighting. Copts lived side by side with Muslim, nothing was touched of their worship places. But you know what CC and shamm, the number of Copts went down because many of them embraced Islam willingly. BTW, modern Copts know this very well.


Just for the record.

Are you talking about the Christian Communities in Alexandria, Egypt? I wouldn't doubt your claim. But wasn't Mohammed a mercenary? History texts have shown that for many of the communities in the Earliest part of Islamic History, it was conversion by the sword. Communities of Jews were even wiped out by Mohammed's army. He tried at first to spread his message peacefully and when that didn't work he used the sword? Am I not correct? Catholic history isn't any prettier either.

[LDSTexan]

Peace.....


Muslimah, I am indeed aware at the peaceful relations the early church and the Coptics had with the adhirants to Islam. It wasn't until Constantine and the advent of Roman Catholicism that things began to go wrong....I also want to point out it was not only Jews and Muslims who suffered during the Spanish Inquisition, that those who were not aligned with Rome also met persicution. Now why they converted to Islam? Well I have an opinion on that:


(2 Timothy 4:1) I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;


(2 Timothy 4:2) Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.


(2 Timothy 4:3) For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;


(2 Timothy 4:4) And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.


Shamms

Constantine was three centuries prior to Islam. The Roman Empire has merely a shell of it's former self by the time Muhammed was born.

[wel_mel_2]

Bismillah:

Muhammed DID spread it by the sword. It was convert or die",

Again another one is talking without evidence. Did you read the whole thread or the other threads on this board that discussed this issue <b>many many times</b>? If Muhammad did spread Islam by the sword, then why <b>he let the pagans who fought him for years go free after the conquest of Mecca? Doesn’t he have the power to kill every unbeliever in Mecca at that time? Doesn’t he have the power to convert all of them to Islam?</b> But no he let them go free, and told them that <b>today no one is going to harm you</b>. What sword are you talking about

Here's a question. Why doesn't the Muslim world ever come out and condemn terrorist acts doen against non-muslims? The silence has me concerned. This world has gone mad.

They do, but sadly you were fooled by the western media as usual. we do strongly condemn terrorism but our voice is not heard in the west simply because the media is controlld by the westerners. (Bush and his friends) and they are feeding you with what they want.


Islamic Schoalrs condemns terrorism in USA


AMERICAN MUSLIMS CONDEMN TERRORISM


Islam 'does not mean killing', says cleric


American Muslims and Scholars denounce Terrorism


So we are not silent about this matter LDSTexan , but you are not listening. <b>Its your fault.</b>


And allow me to quote myself once again because maybe you didn’t read this post:

1. Why did people embrace Islam in the early days when the faithful were subjected to all sorts of trials, tribulations, and persecutions? They were even forced to flee their homes and possessions in order to secure freedom of conscience to practice their religion of choice. who forced them ?
2. How do you explain the historical fact that in virtually all of the conquered territories such as Iraq, Syria, Iran, and Egypt, an enormous number of people entered Islam quite willingly even though they were allowed to remain as they were: Christians, Jews, Zoroastrians, and so on?


3. The Spanish Inquisition instituted against the Muslims and the Jews is a historical fact. Why did many preferred to opt for expulsion or death instead of conversion to Christianity?


4. As the European historians have recorded, thousands and thousands of both Muslims and Jews were slaughtered by the Crusaders in the holy lands; the blood of the victims ran knee deep in the streets of the holy land. Why didn’t they choose to embrace Christianity in order to escape their miserable fate?


5. There are today over 1. 5 billion Muslims in the world coming as they are from diverse racial, ethnic, and religious backgrounds. you ought to ask yourself: Why did such a huge mass of humanity embrace a faith which allegedly teaches such crude notions? Why did they forgo their allegedly superior beliefs and practices?


6. How do you explain the fact that Islam is still the fastest growing religion in the world in spite of the horrendously negative image of Islam and Muslims that is often projected?


7. Newspapers in Great Britain report that an increasingly large number of men and women are converting to Islam in Great Britain in spite of the extremely negative publicity against Islam. The irony is that the majority of those who embrace Islam are women, despite the fact that the media project them as the most disadvantaged in Islam. Whose sword is driving them to join the fold of Islam?


8. Finally, those who allege that Islam was spread through the sword may do well to read an excellent study on the spread of Islam by a former Christian missionary to India and a late professor of Islamic studies at Aligar Muslim University, namely Thomas Arnold; his work is entitled The Preaching of Islam.


if you don’t do the job in order to come to a conclusion, then don’t bother yourself and others.


[Had your Lord willed, all the people on earth would have believed. So can you (Prophet) compel people to believe?] (Yunus 10: 99).


[say, ‘Now the truth has come from your Lord: Let those who wish to believe in it do so, and let those who wish to reject it do so’] (Al-Kahf 17: 29).


[so (people) respond to your Lord before there comes a Day that cannot, against God’s will, be averted—you will have no refuge on that Day, and no possibility of denying (your sins). If they still turn away (remember that) We have not sent you (Prophet) to be their keeper: your duty is to deliver the message] (Ash-Shura 42: 47-48).


[There is no compulsion in religion: true guidance has become distinct from error, so whoever rejects false gods and believes in Allah has grasped the firmest hand-hold, one that will never break. Allah is all hearing and all knowing] (Al-Baqrah 2: 256).

Salam


Wael.

[PUPPET]

Mashallah, Most of you Muslims debate here with Haq , Humility and Wisdom/


A man like me aint got the patience like yall, I wont tolerate cant.... I just feel chatting to the above people is taxing and frustrating (in as mild words as I can put it)


I take lessons from those of you who have patience with the ignorant.


May Allah reward you.