03-02-2007, 01:27 PM
To the Sacred Heart of Jesus, through the Immaculate Heart of Mary.
Assalamo Alikum FHC... its getting hot in here huh :D
Wa alaykum assalam... the roof is on fire, man :D
Two things straight of the bat:
1. How do you treat the Qu'ran? Do you throw it around & place ordinary items on top of it? Would you let your child scribble all over it, rip out pages & scrunch them up - considering it's just a book? Or are you more delicate with the Qur'an because you believe it's holy???
2. When Nike pitched a new shoe design with the name "Allah" (in Arabic) stitched on, the Muslim world went hysterical & cried out, "No, we can't walk on Allah!" So Nike withdrew it's proposal. But isn't is just a piece of material???
Do you see the significance now?
I already said it once, that venerating or revering saints has nothing to do with bowing down to them and asking their help. You should better follow their example and this is the best way to venerate them.
Following their example is what it's primarily all about! We bow as a sign of honour & humility - in similar fashion to how someone bows before the Queen of England.
Only one word is enough FHC. Worshipping an idol who cant even listen to your prayer.
Good grief! WHO'S WORSHIPPING AN IDOL??? Cut it out, Wael... pretty please!
Same as what Pagans said, so there is no difference between you and the Pagan Arabs who once said that we honor those saints in order to bring us closer to God. <b>Polytheism. </b>
Pagans don't believe in Saints nor do they believe in One True God.
Look, you could label Catholics as Satan worshippers for all I care - it's not going to change the fact that Catholics worship God & only God.
Oh please, no one dare to accuse us for praying <b>TOWARDS</b> the Ka’bah because they know very well that no Muslim on earth worship it. <b>No Muslim will ever stand infront of the Ka’bah asking it to help him and be there for him when he die</b>, <b>no one will ever ask the Ka’bah to pray for us</b>. Almost every non Muslim knows very well that Ka’bah is the direction in which Muslim face when they offer their prayers <b>to God alone</b>.
Then why do you face it? :conf06: What if a Muslim prayed facing the opposite direction?
This is all what we got from you guys, but anyway, your fellow Christains told me before the same thing, that we will NEVER understand any of the scriptures unless we are given the gift called <i>‘holy ghost’ </i>
Mate, I think you mean the <i>Gifts of the Holy Spirit - wisdom, understanding, knowledge, counsel, piety, fortitude & fear of the Lord (Isaiah 11:1-3)</i>.
The commandment doesn’t say whether you bow down to her as God or not. it says<b> DO NOT BOW DOWN TO ANY IMAGE</b>. That’s it.
You have no advantage over Satan in quoting Scripture, Wael. The meaning lies in interpretation. You out of all people should know this... is it Iman or Ummah??? Why makes Sunnis right & Shiites wrong?
First of all, we ask <b>ALIVE PEOPLE ON EARTH TO PRAY FOR US</b>.
Secondly who are you to judge whether this saint was granted paradise or not?
Lastly, those who are now dead or alive in heaven have their own issues to care about and they do not hear your prayers at all. In fact God is over watching you while you are praying to His creation, so you better direct your prayer to God alone and ask Him to forgive you.
We ask ALIVE souls too!
God judges. The Church publicly declares it (purely for our benefit).
The main issue Saints in Heaven are concerned with is helping to populate God's Kingdom with all souls - ours!
Only God can forgive.
I am aware of what am saying FHC, don’t forget that my wife was a Catholic. You will never admit that you worship anything beside God, but in practice you are totally repeating the history of Paganism.
Why would I admit something that isn't true :lol:
My brother's girlfriend's a Muslim (Alawite). That doesn't make him an expert on her religion.
I am sorry to offend you by saying this, but I cant be a hypocrite. Every action in the Catholic way of worship <b>is taken directly from olden days Pagan religions.</b>
What about the intention?
I respect your sincerity, but I strongly asking you to think deeply about what we are saying, we are not asking you a reward for this, just think with your mind and leave your emotions aside.
Honestly, I'm so glad you exposed me to the Islamic perception of Catholic worship. Thanks! It'll help me a lot in the future.
Prayers in Islam is <b>SALAH</b>, which is to be done in the Name of God Alone, then we start praising and thanking Him Alone, Glorifying His name Alone, asserting that we worship none but Him alone, and that if we ask of help, we ask of Him alone, then offer supplication to Him that He may guide us to the straight path, bow down to Him Glorying His name, prostrate to Him with humbleness, Witnessing that there is no other god or anything worthy of worship but Him, and that Muhammad pbuh is His slave and messenger.
Nice!
Why only Muhammad (PBUH) & not the other "messengers"???
Are your private intentions (dua) included in Salat?
You know well, that I am the last one here to compare Catholic practices with Islam, and that’s why I use the Bible when discussing with Christians, but you guys are <b>“reading the Bible through somebody else’s glasses”</b>. :D
You're not doing yourself or the Holy Bible any favours :P
"Reading through somebody else's glasses" ... I don't get it! But let's stay on topic for a change - hehe!
That means I have full right to call Jesus of the Bible whom you believe to be God with these titles, for example:
<b>“God the carpenter”</b>
“The sleeping God”
“The thirsty God”
“The weeping God”
“The tempting God”
“The dead God”
If all these terms are offensive to you, then calling Mary “mother of God” is not less offensive than the above terms.
I can't stop you from doing/saying anything, Wael.
The only title from above that's not quite right is the last one ;) The rest possess some kind of truth (more or less).
I don't get offended when people reject Catholic beliefs... it just frustrates me that people criticize Catholicism for what it's not, not for what it is.
No big deal, I guess! Catholics can draw strength from it.
Yes I already said that you will never admit that they are gods, actions speak FHC.
You can say that again & again & again! I only admit truth.
My actions reflects my beliefs. If you don't like what you see, turn away :P
Salam and try to give sometimes to your university. :P
Haha! Friends come first :)
Salam to you too!