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wel_mel_2 · 07-11-2006, 12:11 AM

Bismillah:

Quote:That Gnostic text is no part of scripture and never was. You may as well quote an article from the New York Times which states that Christ wasn't crucified. That book was not written by the apostle Peter. Read the rest of what Peter wrote and did in the book of Acts and you'll see that he knew that Christ was crucified and resurrected.

am sorry CC, let me make this clear statement.

THERE IS NOT A SINGLE VERSE IN THE BIBLE WHERE IT SAYS THAT JESUS RESURRECTED. please pay attention to the word RESURRECTED. if you can find it in the whole Bible referring to Jesus Christ PBUH, do let me know.

this was number one, now do you remember the occasion when Jesus returned to that upper room after his alleged crucifixion: 'And saith unto them, (his disciples), 'Peace be unto you'' (Luke 24:36), and his disciples were terrified on recognizing him?": "Why should they be terrified?" When one recognizes one's long-lost friend or one's beloved, the natural reaction is to feel overjoyed, elated and one wants to embrace and kiss the hands and feet of the beloved. Why did they get terrified?" well, Christians always say because they (the disciples) thought that they were seeing a ghost.

"Did Jesus look like a ghost?" "No." "why did they think that they were seeing a ghost when he did not look like a ghost?"

Please allow me to explain:

the disciples of Jesus were not eye-witnesses or ear-witnesses to the actual happenings of the previous three days, as vouched for by St. Mark who says that at the most critical juncture in the life of Jesus: "they all forsook him and fled." (Mark 14:50). All the knowledge of the disciples regarding their Master was from hearsay. They had heard that their master was hanged on the Cross; they had heard that he had given up the Ghost; they had heard that he was dead and buried for three days. If one is confronted by a person with such a reputation then the conclusion is inescapable; they must be seeing a ghost. Little wonder these ten brave men were petrified."

but how did Jesys deal with this situation??????

Jesus reasoned with them. He said: 'Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself' To put it in colloquial English, this is how he told them: 'What is wrong with you fellows, can't you see that I am the same person - who walked and talked with you, broke bread with you - flesh and blood in all respects.' Why do doubts enter your minds? 'Handle me and see, for a spirit has no flesh and bones as you see me have.' (Luke 24:39). In other words he is telling them: 'If I have flesh and bones, then I am not a ghost, not a spook and not a spirit!'"

Jesus is telling them, as recorded in this verse, in basic English, that what the disciples were asked to "handle and see" was not a translated body, not a metamorphosed body and not a resurrected body, because a resurrected body is a spiritualised body. He is telling them in the clearest language humanly possible that he is not what they were thinking. They were thinking that he was a spirit, a resurrected body, one having been brought back from the dead. He is most emphatic that he is not!"

you may ask "But how can you be so sure that the resurrected body cannot materialize physically as Jesus had obviously done?" the answer is because Jesus had himself pronounced that the resurrected bodies get spiritualised.

Do you remember the incident as recorded in the Gospel of St. Luke, chapter 20, where the learned men of the Jews- "the chief priests and the scribes with the elders"- had come to him with a number of posers, and among them was one about a Jewess who had seven husbands in turn, one after another according to a Jewish custom, and in time all seven husbands and the woman too died?" The trap that the religious hierarchy was trying to spring on him was; which one of the seven husbands was going to possess the woman on the 'Other side'- at the resurrection?- since they reasoned with Jesus that the seven brothers had her.

There was no problem while they fulfilled their obligation of trying to give her a child, because they had possessed her one by one in turn, and it was after the death of one that the other had taken her to wife. But since at the resurrection all seven will be brought to life simultaneously, there will be strife in heaven because all seven would want to get at her at the same time, specially if they had pleasure with her."

"Jesus debunked their false notion of the resurrection, by saying that at the resurrection: 'neither shall they die any more' (Luke 20:36) meaning that the resurrected persons will be Immortalised. They will not be subject to death any more, no more hanger or thirst, no more fatigue. In short, all the instruments of death will be powerless against the resurrected body. Jesus continues to explain: 'for they (the resurrected bodies) are equal unto the angles,' that is, that they will be Angelised - spiritualised, that they will become spirit-creatures, i.e. Spirits;'and the children of God, for such are the children of the Now you compare this with what Jesus said earlier... A SPIRIT HAS NO FLESH AND BONE AS YOU SEE ME HAVE.. means i was not dead, i was not resurrected. clear , simple and plain.

again, h is Not what they were thinking, that he was not a Spirit, not a Ghost, not a Spook. To assure them further after having offered his hands and feet for inspection and verification that his was a material, physical body, and that all their bewilderment and disbelief was unjustified, he asked his disciples: "Have you here any meat?" (Meaning something to eat). "And they gave him a piece of broiled fish and of a honeycomb, and he took it, and did eat before them." (Luke 24:41-43) why he need to eat now????? let Schleliermacher in 1819, Albert Schweizer records him saying: "

Quote:If Christ had only eaten to show that he could eat, while he really had no need of nourishment, if would have been a pretense, something docetic."( In Quest of the Historical Jesus, page 64).

i still could go further, but i will just let you ponder over what was said.

Salam

Wael.

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