06-11-2006, 01:29 PM
Again, you've done me a service by answering those questions Muslimah and Wel Mel.
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"but we can also see some verses in the Bible like "How can you say, 'We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us'? But, behold, the false pen of the scribes has made it (i.e., the bible) into a LIE. (Jeremiah 8:8)"
I wouldn't say that this verse means that the "false pen of the scribes made it into the Bible thus making it a lie." The passage is a warning against false teachers and warnings not to believe them. The words (i.e., the bible) aren't in the verse and reading the passage in context doesn't infer the "bible." The "scribes" were supposed wise men who had no real knowledge of God. This verse does, nor does any other, say that their pens made it into the Bible.
<b>"see Also Deuteronomy 31:25-29 where Moses peace be upon him predicted the corruption/tampering of the Law (Bible) after his death."</b>
Not quite. Moses predicted their their rebellion against the Law and the things which Moses taught them. The passage does not say that they will corrupt the Bible.
Deuteronomy 31 26-29
26 "Take this Book of the Law and place it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God. There it will remain as a witness against you. 27 For I know how rebellious and stiff-necked you are. If you have been rebellious against the LORD while I am still alive and with you, how much more will you rebel after I die! 28 Assemble before me all the elders of your tribes and all your officials, so that I can speak these words in their hearing and call heaven and earth to testify against them. 29 For I know that after my death you are sure to become utterly corrupt and to turn from the way I have commanded you. In days to come, disaster will fall upon you because you will do evil in the sight of the LORD and provoke him to anger by what your hands have made."
Moses is responding to what God has just told him in the preceding versus:
Deuteronomy 31: 14-18
15 Then the LORD appeared at the Tent in a pillar of cloud, and the cloud stood over the entrance to the Tent. 16 And the LORD said to Moses: "You are going to rest with your fathers, and these people will soon prostitute themselves to the foreign gods of the land they are entering. They will forsake me and break the covenant I made with them. 17 On that day I will become angry with them and forsake them; I will hide my face from them, and they will be destroyed. Many disasters and difficulties will come upon them, and on that day they will ask, 'Have not these disasters come upon us because our God is not with us?' 18 And I will certainly hide my face on that day because of all their wickedness in turning to other gods.
As you can see it doesn't say that the Law or the Bible will be corrupted. Rather it predicts that the Law will be disobeyed.
<b>"According to the early Christians' manuscripts, Jesus never got crucified, and trinity is a lie."</b>
That isn't true. As I've said before, the earliest manuscripts in existence include the death of Christ on the cross and the resurrection. Even if you don't include Mark 16: 9-20 Jesus is still crucified and resurrected. SO, if you can show me legitamate early manuscripts, I guess it would have to be the earliest ones, which don't include the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ I'd love to see them.
As far as Mark 16's ending is concerned there is question as to whether that ending is original or if it was added later. This is one case of unknown or confirmed abrogation. I think there is a lengthy post about abrogation in the Qur'an which Muslimah showed me. Her answer in #23 was basically that Allah changed the verse<i> "This incident was somehow misinterpreted as that waliyadhubillah satan was able to throw this part to the Messenger salla Allah a`lyhee wa sallam who just repeated it but then Allah abrogated this part and took it off. "</i>
Mark 16 long ending appears very early in the early manuscripts. It is confirmed by history that the longer ending was cannon as of 170 AD.
In 177 AD Irenaeus wrote Against Heresies. In it he cites from Mark 16:19, establishing that the longer reading was in existence at this time and was considered canonical, at least by Irenaeus:
Also, towards the conclusion of his Gospel, Mark says: "So then, after the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, He was received up into heaven, and sitteth on the right hand of God; " confirming what had been spoken by the prophet: "The LORD said to my Lord, Sit Thou on My right hand, until I make Thy foes Thy footstool." Thus God and the Father are truly one and the same; He who was announced by the prophets, and handed down by the true Gospel; whom we Christians worship and love with the whole heart, as the Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things therein.