Are the Prophets sinless?

[wel_mel_2]

Bismillah:

wel_mel_2 wrote:
A lie is "a false statement deliberately presented as being true".  Jesus believed what he said to be true, therefore what he said wasn't a lie.  But if we assume Jesus was referring to His return on the day of final judgement (an assumption not all Christians make), then he obviously made a mistake (which is not a sin).


Jesus also said:


"But about that day or that hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, not even the Son; only the Father."  Mark 13:32


So, Jesus never claimed to know when the final judgement would take place.


In any case, we are discussing the Koran and hadith, not the Bible.  What does the Bible have to do with the Muslim belief that Prophets are without sin???  Obviously, the Bible states the exact opposite:  all people (except Jesus) have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God.


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Here is a question to ponder:


Q: If a Muslim eats pork, has he made a mistake, or committed a sin?

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of course he was referring to his coming back, what else you guess he was referring to ?


and now according to your own admission that mistakes are not considered to be sins, then all the prophets of God are sinless because they've done mistakes as any other human being but their mistakes were not intentionally.


<b>and point to ponder (off topic) , if Jesus pbuh never claimed to know when the final judgment would take place that is clear proof that he is not God.</b>


REGARDING THE BIBLE: you always say all prophets except Jesus have sinned according to the Bible, it is you who brought the bible issue here not me. and since you are comparing your beliefs with ours, then you have to accept our comparison as well and look into your OWN BIBLE and you will see that Jesus clearly have sinned. and if the previous bible references i gave you are not enough. then you have to explain the following:


John 18:20 - When being questioned by the high priest, Jesus answered, "I <b>spake openly</b>
to the world; I have <b>ever</b>
** taught in the synagogues and in the temple, and in secret have I <b>said nothing</b>
."


Here he told two lies. For example, the Sermon on the Mount, perhaps his most famous sermon was delivered neither in a synagogue nor in the temple but on a mountain top (Matthew 5:1.) In Matthew 16:20 he warns his disciples <b>not to tell anyone</b> that he was the Messiah. In other words, <b>Keep it a secret</b>.


can you see ? what he preach he dont practice!! this is not our Jesus peace be upon him.


I Thessalonians 4:15-17 - In his first Epistle to the Thessalonians the Apostle Paul told a whopper when he assured the congregation that the second coming of Jesus is very near. " . . . <b>we </b>
who are alive, . . . shall not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven . . . and the dead in Christ shall rise first. Then we <b>who are alive </b>
and remain shall be caught up together . . ."


Revelation 22:7, 12, 20 - Jesus says, "Behold, I come quickly."


Almost two thousand years have passed, all those who knew him are long dead, yet Jesus’ promise of a quick return remains unfulfilled. I think it’s time to acknowledge that either the New Testament Gospels are fiction or that Jesus flat-out lied***


so if you consider the above statements are mistakes NOT SINS then we do consider that ALL prophets including Jesus have made mistakes and not SINS.


peace


Wael.