Jihad in Palestine

[Ibn_kumuna]

Salaam Alaikum!

"Know what you are talking about before you speak. Islam was spread by

FORCE"

Oh come now, lad. Don't obfuscate!

--Ibn

[Abohamza30]

Who is the \"we\" you speak of ?  Superior but not perfect perhaps ? I mean, who has the moralistic high ground when 2 hijacked planes slam into civilian buildings, who has the moral high ground when nearly 200 people are killed while commuting on a train all in Allah's name ? Or a movie theater full of people are held to ransom by jihadi moojahadeen ? Or a pregnant woman is killed and her 4 children executed while strapped in their child seats at the hands of the brave (martyred shortly after) palestine jihadis?  

No it hasn't. Only in your eyes and in your opinion.  

Hey, there probably are some laws in there that make sense but lets face it, even a blind pig finds a truffle every now and again.

What are you talking about now ? Communist oppression of Josef Stalin or Islamic tyranny in Afghanistan, it is difficult to determine the difference.

No it didn't, the \"golden age\" is a complete fabrication. There never was a golden age for jews and christians under islamic rule.

Hello JhonDoe,

I hope this not make you feel impressed that am comparing religions but I will illustrate the meanings of what you have quoted from my previous message.

I Meant by "We" All people, no matter what religion, faith, color and origion they are!! and here is my example: You sign that you spent much money on booze, cars and wommen which is a SIN all moralistic values, however it represents an apathetic personality, but I see you are quit educated and do I judge you by your past? and Can I say that ALL christians or your family maybe is sinfull and outside the circle of humanity, maybe Insane if this compares to what you accuse ISLAM of? Moslems now represent 1/5th the worlds population and it is true not all moslems are perfect, including me.Some Moslems do represent Islam by passport now, and their actions are being used to picture islam judisciously to plot some general picture of islam. The terrorist acts done by some fundamentalists is absolute sin and is not a teaching of Islam. Jihad is a pillar of islam against any Invador who destroys Money, Soul and kin and kith, and is a human response in all communities, example is the religious wars in Europe in the 19th century that eradicated 200 thousand Protostants in north Ireland and Europe, Isnt this a sin? or isnt this a racist war? or what kind of war that is? Do I have the right to generalize that all Catholics are Gorry? Nope I think. The spanish crussade wars in North Brazil and Carribean in the 18th Century( Hope I am not mistacken) went under the flag of Christ, leaders there were slayed because they refused to Kiss the Bible! and another leader fell the bible by Mistacke on the floor and it was misunderstood he was humilating the Holly Book and was beheaded Immediately and his kingdome was dominated by war merchants Under the name of Christ? Do I dare calling Christians now are sinfull or maybe all are pushing religion into people's throats by terror? I think No, because we know there are true Christians and Jews now and always there have been goodness within people everywhere.

So Doesnt islam do so, some Mistackes on the individual level did happen, Yes!! due to lack of Knowledge about the True Teachings of islam even in war conditions.

And for the GOLDEN AGE of Christians and Jews, I suggest you read the Books of Phillipe Hittie- AntiMoslem on all levels- which are used to teach History of science among Arabs in US and Europe Universities. Many think man has never been faith in what he wrote about Arabs and Moslems in his books, but I think he did Give them the proper place they deserve interms of Justice regarding treating non-moslems and their scientific contribution. I think History have been RE-WRITTEN several times, and especially the literature that talks about islam in west in general, and this is evidenced by new generation of Authors who reviewed the literature about Moslems in the west in modern time, and I will give you books about Mistackes in the history being educated there if you wish?

The Lawyers am talking about represent high rank Law experts in everywhere including Americas, Africa, RUSSIA, however Chinese leaders and law experts!!!! Do you want me get to Copy-Paste to prove my point? you might have the couriosity to VERIFY their Authenticity like some did before you!!!! Next time tell me if you want them!!!! Am not comparing Jhon!!! but you need to rethink of what you always say in here about islam. islam have nothing to do with what some of its followers do!!!

Ask Yourself who created the Qaeda and aided them with Stinger Missiles and munition, and you will know who engineer the events to end in terror!

May this clarifi to you that Islam is not what you learnt from what some literature say .You need to be fair in your statments And not generalize .

may Allah Bestow on You with his Mercy.

[Abohamza30]

LOL..Dude what the hell are you talking about? Persians saw the Arabs as barbarians and as enemies rather than liberators! They saw themselves as a superior people, and they were willing to fight to defend their homeland. Islam's warriors ran into resistance led by local Persian leaders.  To resist the Arabs, the last of the Sassanid kings, Yezdegird III, raised an army of 150,000 men. But with victory in Egypt, the Muslims were able to send reinforcements at a critical moment. At the Battle of Nihawand, 30,000 Muslims routed Yezdegird's army, the Muslims catching and massacring the Persians in narrow gorges. Muslims saw this as their greatest victory, and it was decided that all of Persia should be subdued. Umar was able to concentrate on this conquest. Yezdegird III fled eastward, and in 652, near Merv, he was murdered by local thieves for his jewelry. Sassanid Persia had come to an end, but it would be many years before Islam would be able to subdue Persia as far as its eastern border.

In Persia , Zoroastrianism was doomed as a great religion. In response to conquest by Islam's armies, the Zoroastrians would foment rebellions, and the conquering Muslims responded. In many provinces the Muslims forced Zoroastrians to convert to Islam, while many Zoroastrians adopted Nestorian Christianity instead. Here and there Zoroastrianism would survive. But in the coming centuries conversions to Islam would leave Zoroastrians a small minority.

Know what you are talking about before you speak. Islam was spread by FORCE.

I know very well what I speak , Hazam!

I know many Persians throughout history have carried so much hatred to the Arabic race which conquered the Persians. And it is wel documented that many Persian authores-including present authors- showed this in their writings back in history either explicitly or Implicitly.There have been so much FALSIFICATION of events pertaining to Umar Bin Al-khattab(May Allah be pleased about Him) and the other companions of The Prophet. When you talk about history, you need yourself know what point you are fending of and bringing up. You are rolling up old carpets that weared with time because it was not well fabricated origionally.

Islam have never been forced into anybody's throat, Niether by sword nor by Psychological abuse. However Mistackes of such kind did occur-on individual level even in Makkah where Islam started and here is a story to make this even more clear:During the tardes that happened between the Moslems in Madinah after Hijra, the Prophet sent Moawiyah with a bunch of Moslems to Negotiate with the Nobel Men of Makkah regarding the new moslems who wanted to leave to Madina and Makkans did not permit them, then a battle occured because Makkans did not come to peace with the moslems with Moawiyah, then Moslems fought untill they won the battle and came back to Mohammad PBUH, when Mohammad Asked them what happened between you and the Nobel men of Makkah, one of the men we didnt find anything Nobel their, we found ANIMALS(Arabic Ana'am) and we slayed all of them. The Prophet was upset with what they said first, that the Makkans were Nobel men and they deserve being called as they were, because they used to be Masters among their people and the second is that the Moslems could have showed them some Respect to those men as they found it difficult to sit with weak moslems that time, So islam does forbid forcing and Never forced anybody unless an Individual mistacke did happen.

Christians times Umar and following leaders had positions in islamic army like other, another example during sallahuddin al-ayyobi who fought the crussadors in palestine.... His first right hand was Eissa Al-ghattas(Eissa the diver who died while christian...) but he fought crussadors who are his similes, but he knew they were not in palestine to serve the Cross, he realized that they were there for wealth!!!!

Here is a Christian Study that Proves That islam did not spread by sword, and this study is achived by a Christian schoolar bytheway in Arabic:

http://saaid.net/Anshatah/dawah/47.htm

Islam came to Invite All Mankind to Worship one God( Allah) so, worhsiping Fire was to be copied anyways, and this is a bless Allah gave Arabs to have braught All nations to Worhsip GOD(Allah) not fire despite they used to be IGNORANTS and maybe Barbaric.... Allah Raised them and Moslems above every nation because they BELIEVED And WORKED!!!!

So, I believe that you still carry some of what Some persians had in their hearts against Arab Moslems, or maybe you are much affected by this kind of psychological deviation through reading.

[Deen]

In many provinces the Muslims forced Zoroastrians to convert to Islam, while many Zoroastrians adopted Nestorian Christianity instead.

Know what you are talking about before you speak. Islam was spread by FORCE.

(Assalam) to my dear muslim brother and sisters!

This is my first time on this discussion board so please bare with me!

In response to your accusation that Islam was spread by "FORCE", the Quran tells us in Surah Al-Baqara that "There is no compulsion in religion".

So it is not allowed for muslims to force anyone to the Islamic aqeedah (doctrine).

Islam was spread via Jihad which is the foreign policy of the state which means that Islam is the system man must live under. BUT, Islam never forced anyone to leave their belief as man is allowed to keep his belief but live under Islam.

I must add that there are many misconceptions and distorted views about how Islam was spread mainly by those who detest Islam such as the orientalists.

[Muslimah]

as salam alykom Deen

welcome to our board Insh aAllah you will benefit and help us benefit too.

Well I dont think I will add anything here, this topic was really exhausted on the board.

Alhamdulelah

[Abohamza30]

(bismillah

Thank you Sister/Brother Deen.

Your Input is wonderfull and makes much difference :thumup: . I was trying to clarify the fact that Islam declines terror and is against compulsion, but what is surprisng me is to see a Moslem say that the spread of Islam was by sword. Yes! Jihad is the exterior policy and is not the aim of Islam, Jihad is meant to protect Islamic state borders, to protect and support other moslems, and is a method of communicating islam to other places, but not Obligating them to embrace Islam by FORCE. They are free to choose their own religion but Pay Jizyah.

Orientalists made much change on what they carried to their Societies. They altered the facts and truths so that next generations in their countries will remain blinded from . Their Gelousy and hatred of the wonderfull words of God obliged them to falsify the truth and give a wrong picture. This forum is meant for clarification of and communication of Islam message to people from other societies who are grown up with false teachings about Islam and Quraan.

You are welcome to Islam message forum.

(Assalam)

[Muslimah]

as salam alykom AboHamza

just a slight correction Hazam's is not a Muslim.....this is according to what he described himself as agnostic

[Abohamza30]

He must be agnostic, Yeah! :thumup:

I understand, No wonder..... Then he falls in what I already explained to himself that some Persians carried hatred to islam with history. No wonder.... But I hope this gets him what he needed to hear from this forum.

Thank you , Moslimah

[radiyah]

Alsalam 'alaykom brother Hamza, may Allah accept your effort with these two guys, they are both agnostics John and Hazam, we have a tough job here with these 2, may Allah be our assistant.

John I think this is the second time u call me naieve, when u don't like my answer then I am naieve. anyways thanku. But I would like to add here that even sunni Muslims in Iran are abused, they are not allowed to have or export sunni books, and most are trying to leave iran because they are highly abused. I just came back from lebanon, my family there are talking about how Hizb Allah is so domineering in Beirut, and they have force over the sunni muslims, even terrifying them(I will not explain more). I think I will not explain again what are shia's are, and I think I explained before with pictures as well, or do u want me to show u more disgusting pictures of shia's torturing themselves and their children.?

and as for 9/11 please be kind enough to read this:

from lewis news

Shadow of a hologram As 9/11 debunkers drift, controversial theory lingers


http://www.lewisnews.com/article.asp?ID=79059

The fatal flaw in the 9/11 coverup: Why can no one name the hijackers or prove they flew the planes?


http://www.lewisnews.com/article.asp?ID=77925

More interisting articles here as well.

http://www.lewisnews.com/section.asp?ID=83...+New+Resistance

why don't u read also the article that says:

President who talks to God


Enjoy reading John.

And yes one more thing, as brother Hamza said, or conveyed that alqaeda is the baby of USA, just like Saddam and his likes, Saddam's role ended, so they got rid of him, when alQaedda role will end, they will know when to get rid of Usama bin laden. And so is Yaser arafat for the jews as well, or how come every honest palistenian leader is killed except him he is still there stuck on the chair.

Welcome to the board brother Deen, may Allah assist u and be your guide and help us with your knowledge on this board.

[Dan]

Bismillah

So if it is a conspiracy or puppet government against Islam then you are bored or blow it off? But if there is something fishy going on with a muslim leader then what muslims have to say suddenly becomes interesting?

interesting.