German Catholics Urge Full Rights To Muslims

[Dan]

Bismillah

Michelle,

Sister Jennifer has pointed out what I was trying to say. Your experience with Catholicism is obviously different than the one I had or the one that Jennifer had. So we were really not catholic and the people who were teaching us the faith really not catholic either? I watched the change in the church's views as I was growing up in this education. How is this a religion sanctioned by God when it changes with the tides of men's feelings? The amount of people was dropping so changes are made. Membership increases because the faith once again fits the needs of the people.

I would also like to know which of my facts were incorrect and false so I know what to ask on that website please. I wrote quite a bit and do not want to have to write paragraphs again if I can avoid it.

Islam has not changed my dislike for typing.

I appreciate our dialogue.

Jazak Allah Sister Jennifer.

As salam alaikum

[MichelleSeeking]

I know that the Church changed customs but that is different then changing Dogma. Customs help us discipline ourselves and they can be changed as our culture changes. This has nothing to do with our salvation. I think that you and Sister Jennifer might be confusing the changing of customs with changing Dogma. Also, there are a lot of liberal people in the Church and they can teach incorrect things in parishes and Catholic schools. This happens all of the time, sadly. People that were once conservative teachers of the faith can turn around and teach liberal nonsense. That's why we are always urged to compare teachings to Dogma so that we can see if anything has been changed. However, that does not mean that the Church is the one that is doing the changing and we shouldn't shun the whole orchard for the rotten apples on the ground.

Can you tell me exactly what you saw changed? That would help me immensly.

For example: what were you taught about confession and what is your daughter being taught now?

If Dogma has been changed then I'd like to know!!! :eek:

[SisterJennifer]

My daughter is not being taught anything now, as that was 4 years ago she had to make 1st confession, and we are no longer Catholic. In a nutshell it is pretty much as descibed in my above post. Basically for her (and my son the following year) they held a parent meeting beforehand to explain what they were telling the kids and give us the opportunity to ask questions. Sadly, this did not end up well as quite a few parents were very upset at what they saw to be a diversion away from the faith. For example, one of the things they were teaching this generation is that while confession necessary, it is not mandatory to tell the Priest ALL of your sins, if you were uncomfortable God will know how you are feeling and it is as if you had told the Preist. This is what caused a bit of conflict.

My generation was told that if you did not confess EVERYTHING great and small, there is no chance whatsoever that you will ever be forgiven and you will be doomed for your disrespect to God's request for forgiveness, and the only way you can be forgiven is through confession.

Well, I hope sharing that with you help answer your question Michelle.



Best regards,

~Jennifer

[MichelleSeeking]

I think the problem lies with your local parish rather then the entire Catholic Church because I've never been taught the wishy-washy stuff your daughter was taught and I've belonged to parishes all over the world. I've had some friends that have very similar experiences as you but they aren't the majority. Every time they tried to find out why they were taught what they were taught it could be traced back to the parish, not the acctual teachings of the Church. They have remained unchanged. Blaming the whole Church for the mistakes of individual parishes isn't the right path to follow.

I realize that you are no longer Catholic so this doesn't really matter. I just wish for you to see how these problems are localized in parishes with wishy-washy modern religious classes, rather then thinking that the acctual teachings of the Church have been changed. They haven't. Yet some people change them on their own and teach them as if they were teaching the Truth, when they aren't. It's a sad reality.

[John 3:16]

Why SisterJennifer did you jump ship?

Many leave because they are unhappy with the physical church and the men who currently lead the way, that will always happen and it will happen to Islam down the road when all muslims are fully democratized, it's just a matter of time.

Eventually maybe within the next 50 years, you'll have a great number of liberal muslims, some even who will take a non-literal approach to Islam. It will happen, it's happening in Christianity, it's been happening in Christianity for about the last 150 years or more.

[Muslimah]

No John this won't happen, there is much difference between Islam and Muslims. NO matter how many are there of liberals, Islam shall remian the same and we Insh a Allah shall remain gladly following it:)

[SisterJennifer]

Hi Michelle,

I should have pointed out that this wasn't one parish working alone, all the churches in our diocese follow the same procedures. Same workbooks, videos etc. If I remember correctly the peocedures for all sacraments must be approved by the diocese for the reasons that you stated.

I hope I do not sound as though I want to bash the Catholics. I understand mistakes can and do happen everywhere that is human nature. I'm just sharing one small chapter of my life. Thanks for listening to it.

Jennifer

[MichelleSeeking]

You'll always find weeds in every garden.

[Muslimah]

as salam a`alaman itba`alhoda

Michelle it is true that I am a born Muslim, although we all are, yes matter of fact we are all born Muslims as indicated from this verse:"And (remember) when your Lord brought forth from the Children of Adam, from their loins, their seed (or from Adam’s loin his offspring) and made them testify as to themselves (saying): "Am I not your Lord?" They said: "Yes! We testify," lest you should say on the Day of Resurrection: "Verily, we have been unaware of this." (Quran 7:172), then the parents change children religion to Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism or others, but basically we are all born Muslims. However, living in Egypt among a number of Christians gave me the chance of course to mix with them. Matter of fact I grew up with a Christian friend since we were 19. The dominating sect among Egyptians is the Orthozox, I am surprised that most americans dont have an idea abuot it. For example, Catholics dont observe fasting, they do, and they believe that Jesus is God himself not son of God who materialized and came down to save mankind. Any way, they also truly and strongly believe that we Muslims shall certainly go to hell because of our belief that Jesus is only a Messenger and Prophet of Allah.

Just felt to share this info.

[John 3:16]

I'm not a Muslim, I am a son of God.