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The Arabic Bible!!!
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 Peace.... Do I know what slander is? Of course. Slander is a malicious, false, and defamatory statement or report. Saying that Christ is not the only begotten Son of God is indeed, according to the Bible, slander. A question was asked directly to me, I'm sorry if you don't like the answer I gave. I am a follower of Christ according to the Bible, did you really think I would accept malicious attacks to the character and purpose of Jesus Christ? Radiyah, why do you seem so surprised? 
11-16-2008, 03:13 PM
Slander is a malicious, false, and defamatory statement or report............... Maybe you should have looked up defamatory as well. You are talking about a difference in belief, nothing more. This does not constitute slander.
11-16-2008, 05:57 PM
Peace.... Defamatory - containing defamation; injurious to reputation; slanderous or libelous. My position does not change. Islam's statements that Christ was not begotten of God and was not crucified are indeed injurious to Christ's reputation and are therefore defamatory in nature. Jennifer, why do you believe a belief system cannot be slanderous and defamatory? 
11-17-2008, 09:30 AM
Bismillah I am not surprised shamms why do u think I am dont change the subject, and I also consider your beleif as slander against Allah Subhanahu wa TA'la and His Oneness , and I put for You the Mubahala Ayah are u willing to do that shams, if u dont know what I mean I will be willingly happy to explain it to you and I am willing to do it, you ignored that, are u willing to do Mubahla shams ??? Lo! the likeness of Jesus with Allah is as the likeness of Adam. He created him of dust, then He said unto him: Be! and he is. (59) (This is) the truth from thy Lord (O Muhammad), so be not thou of those who waver. (60) This is The Mubahala verse <b></b> And whoso disputeth with thee concerning him, after the knowledge which hath come unto thee, say (unto him): Come! We will summon our children and your children, and our women and your women, and ourselves and yourselves, then we will pray humbly (to our Lord) and (solemnly) invoke the curse of Allah upon those who lie. (61) Lo! This verily is the true narrative. There is no God save Allah, and lo! Allah he verily, is the Mighty, the Wise. (62) And if they turn away, then lo! Allah is Aware of (who are) the corrupters. (63) Say: O People of the Scripture! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto Him). (64) O People of the Scripture! Why will ye argue about Abraham, when the Torah and the Gospel were not revealed till after him? Have ye then no sense? (65) The Holy Quran 3, Surat Al-Nisa' So r u ready ????? Peace
11-17-2008, 09:45 AM
Bismillah Okay this is the story of Mubahla, so you will decide to do it or not: <b>The reason for the call to Mubahalah and the revelation of the Ayat from the beginning of this Surah until here, is that a delegation from the Christians of Najran (in Yemen) came to Al-Madinah to argue about `Isa, claiming that he was divine and the son of Allah. Allah sent down the beginning of this Surah until here, to refute their claims, as Imam Muhammad bin Ishaq bin Yasar and other scholars stated.</b> Muhammad bin Ishaq bin Yasar said in his famous Sirah, "The delegation of Christians from Najran came to the Messenger of Allah . The delegation consisted of sixty horsemen, including fourteen of their chiefs who make decisions. These men were Al-`Aqib, also known as `Abdul-Masih, As-Sayyid, also known as Al-Ayham, Abu Harithah bin `Alqamah, of [the family of] Bakr bin Wa`il and Uways bin Al-Harith. They also included, Zayd, Qays, Yazid, Nabih, Khuwaylid, `Amr, Khalid, `Abdullah and Yuhannas. Three of these men were chiefs of this delegation, Al-`Aqib, their leader and to whom they referred for advice and decision; As-Sayyid, their scholar and leader in journeys and social gatherings; and Abu Harithah bin `Alqamah, their patriarch, priest and religious leader. Abu Harithah was an Arab man from [the family of] Bakr bin Wa`il, but when he embraced Christianity, the Romans and their kings honored him and built churches for him (or in his honor). They also supported him financially and gave him servants, because they knew how firm his faith in their religion was.'' Abu Harithah knew the description of the Messenger of Allah from what he read in earlier divine Books. However, his otherwise ignorance led him to insist on remaining a Christian, because he was honored and had a high position with the Christians. Ibn Ishaq said, "Muhammad bin Ja`far bin Az-Zubayr said that, `The (Najran) delegation came to the Messenger of Allah in Al-Madinah, entered his Masjid wearing robes and garments, after the Prophet had prayed the `Asr prayer. They accompanied a caravan of camels led by Bani Al-Harith bin Ka`b. The Companions of the Messenger of Allah who saw them said that they never saw a delegation like them after that... Then Abu Harithah bin `Alqamah and Al-`Aqib `Abdul-Masih or As-Sayyid Al-Ayham spoke to the Messenger of Allah , and they were Christians like the king (Roman King). However, they disagreed about `Isa; some of them said, `He is Allah,' while some said, `He is the son of Allah,' and some others said, `He is one of a trinity.' Allah is far from what they attribute to Him.'' Indeed, these are the creeds of the Christians. They claim that `Isa is God, since he brought the dead back to life, healed blindness, leprosy and various illnesses, told about matters of the future, created the shape of birds and blew life into them, bringing them to life. However, all these miracles occurred by Allah's leave, so that `Isa would be a sign from Allah for people. They also claim that `Isa is the son of Allah, since he did not have a father and he spoke when he was in the cradle, a miracle which had not occurred by any among the Children of Adam before him, so they claim. They also claim that `Isa is one of a trinity, because Allah would say, `We did, command, create and demand.' They said, `If Allah were one, he would have said, `I did, command, create and decide.' This is why they claim that `Isa and Allah are one (Trinity). Allah is far from what they attribute to Him, and we should mention that the Qur'an refuted all these false Christian claims. Ibn Ishaq continued, "When these Ayat came to the Messenger from Allah , thus judging between him and the People of the Book, Allah also commanded the Prophet to call them to the Mubahalah if they still refused the truth. The Prophet called them to the Mubahalah. They said, `O Abu Al-Qasim! Let us think about this matter and get back to you with our decision to what we want to do.' They left the Prophet and conferred with Al-`Aqib, to whom they referred to for advice. They said to him, `O `Abdul-Masih! What is your advice' He said, `By Allah, O Christian fellows! You know that Muhammad is a Messenger and that he brought you the final word regarding your fellow (`Isa). You also know that no Prophet conducted Mubahalah with any people, and the old persons among them remained safe and the young people grew up. Indeed, it will be the end of you if you do it. If you have already decided that you will remain in your religion and your creed regarding your fellow (`Isa), then conduct a treaty with the man (Muhammad) and go back to your land.' They came to the Prophet and said, `O Abu Al-Qasim! We decided that we cannot do Mubahalah with you and that you remain on your religion, while we remain on our religion. However, send with us a man from your Companions whom you are pleased with to judge between us regarding our monetary disputes, for you are acceptable to us in this regard.''' Al-Bukhari recorded that Hudhayfah said, "Al-`Aqib and As-Sayyid, two leaders from Najran, came to the Messenger of Allah seeking to invoke Allah for curses (against whoever is unjust among them), and one of them said to the other, `Let us not do that. By Allah, if he were truly a Prophet and we invoke Allah for curses, we and our offspring shall never succeed afterwards.' So they said, `We will give you what you asked and send a trusted man with us, just a trusted man.' The Messenger of Allah said; ("Verily, I will send a trusted man with you, a truly trustworthy man.'' The Companions of the Messenger of Allah all felt eager to be that man. The Messenger said, "O Abu `Ubaydah bin Al-Jarrah! Stand up.'' When Abu `Ubaydah stood up, the Messenger of Allah said, "This is the trustee of this Ummah.''') This is it, and it is true and happened at the time of The Prophet peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, I am waiting for your answer shams. Peace
11-18-2008, 05:07 PM
Peace...... Radiyah you asked: "are u willing to do Mubahla shams ???" So the Mubahla is praying together to invoke the curse of allah on the one who is lying? How can we pray together when we pray to two separate deities? I pray to the God of the Bible called YHVH or Yahovah. You pray to the god of the Qur'an called Allah. Two separate and distinct beings. So I cannot do the Mubahla with you as I cannot pray to your god. And there is no reason for me to pray to my God to curse you. If He is unknown to you, you are cursed already.
11-19-2008, 07:54 AM
Bismillah Shamms you are again turning around the bush, and it is not up to you to say I am cursed you are not God, nor am i to say that, even if u r not a muslim, I as a muslim do not give myself the right to curse you or say that you are a kafer in your face nor behind u, because I do not know the future, no one knows what your end will be. And we worship the same God, Allah is The Creator of this world and you have ascribed a son to Him, we worship Him as One, you worship him as three, so we worship the same God but with difference in belief, so why don't you do Mubahla what are u afraid off, the curse will show in this life before the hereafter, so if u think I am cursed, what are u afraid off, do it again I will be more cursed and u will be more happy, or u do not want to take the challenge. You know what Shamms, since you r not accepting to do it, then u r doing the same as the Najran christians did, which is a proof to the word of Allah, so in this case I will tell you <b>And if they turn away, then lo! Allah is Aware of (who are) the corrupters. (63) </b> Say: O People of the Scripture! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto Him). (64) O People of the Scripture! Why will ye argue about Abraham, when the Torah and the Gospel were not revealed till after him? Have ye then no sense? (65) The Holy Quran 3, Surat Al-Nisa' I raise my hands to <b>Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'la, The All Mighty, The Glorious, The Hearing, The Most Gracious , to show you the true path Shamms and enlighten your heart and all those who lost the true path of Allah,</b> Islam is not cursing, Islam is not attacking others and cursing them and saying "you are cursed", I am just a human being who do not have the right to curse anyone, The only one who has that right is Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'la, and He mentioned it in The Holy Quran, and that curse is on those who die on the wrong belief lying to people and preventing them from knowing the truth. So see u hastened to curse me, but I did not. Alhamdulilah Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'la will preserve me and all believing Muslims with His Mercy and Grace insha'Allah. O Allah Subhanak to what they ascribe to you, Subhanaka to what they worship with you, and all praises and blessings upon our Prophet Muhammad Salla Allah alayhi wa salam and on his kins and companions Ameeeeeeeeen. ![[Image: bnr073.gif]](http://www.sultanyat-jeddah.com/webpg/ourpg/islam/banner/bnr073.gif) Peace Quote:Bismillah Peace.... Radiyah, Shamms is not personally cursing you, Shamms is quoting the Bible: John 3:18 (18) <b>No one who has faith in God's Son will be condemned. But everyone who doesn't have faith in him has already been condemned for not having faith in God's only Son.</b> Since you do not believe that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God, you are, according to the Bible, condemned already. No one is attacking you, I'm only informing you of what the Bible says. It's not a matter of knowing the future Radiyah, I am speaking, according to your words here, about where you stand with Christ now. You're correct, no one knows the future, and perhaps Yahovah will give you repentance to the acknowledging of the truth (2nd Timothy 2:25,26). Quote:And we worship the same God, Allah is The Creator of this world and you have ascribed a son to Him, we worship Him as One, you worship him as three, so we worship the same God but with difference in belief, so why don't you do Mubahla what are u afraid off, the curse will show in this life before the hereafter, so if u think I am cursed, what are u afraid off, do it again I will be more cursed and u will be more happy, or u do not want to take the challenge. Radiyah, your book (Qur'an) and my book (Bible) speak of two very different deities. Anyone who has studied the books can tell you that. So no, we do not worship the same God, because my God said in his Word concerning Jesus Christ: Matthew 3:17 (17) <b>and behold, a voice from heaven said, "This is my beloved Son, with whom I am well pleased."</b> While in your book, allah does not have a son, he begets not. So no, it is not simply the same God and a difference of belief. Your book and my book teach two very different fundamental things. My Bible teaches that Salvation can only be obtained through Jesus Christ, who being God, took the form of a man, and was crucified for the sins of his sheep. I do not wish to pray to your god and offend my own. You say I am like the Najran Christians, I do not know who they were but if they did not turn from the truth that is Jesus Christ, then it sounds like good company to be in.  Bismillah: Assalamo Alikum sister, Sis Radiyah, allow me please to jump in and respond to AlShamms... <b>'AlShamms' </b> Quote:John 3:18 According to the Bible <b>SON</b> means <b>SERVANT</b>… and that’s why in different translations of the Bible these terms were used <b>synonymously</b>, for example we read: <b>King James Version</b> Acts 3:25 - Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed. Acts 3:26 - Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities. <b>New King James Version SAME VERSE</b> Acts 3:25 - You are the sons of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying to Abraham, 'And in your seed all the families of the earth shall be blessed. Acts 3:26 - To you first, God, having raised up His Servant Jesus, sent Him to bless you, in turning every one of you away from his iniquities. In the KJV, we find that Jesus is God's Son. In the NKJV, we find that He is God's servant. These are clearly not the same! <b>Unless they are synonymous!!!!</b> Or maybe you can say, that those who come up with the NKJV translation <b>denied the deity of Jesus and that’s why they used the word SERVANT instead of SON!!!</b> And so did the translators of NIV, ASV, NASB and other modern translations??? But look, the same translators of the NKJV translated this Greek word <b>PAIS</b> as BOY, CHILD and SON in other places like Mathew 2:16, 17:18 etc… <b>but they refused intentionally to translate the SAME GREEK WORD as SON where peter was presenting Jesus as the Messiah and son of God!!!! </b> I wonder, why the translators were so determined to deny the deity of Jesus in this specific passage? Is this the Bible that you are claiming to be God’s word??? or is it a book that you can trust with your eternal destiny? i wonder!!!!!!!! So we as Muslims do not hesitate in accepting Jesus “<b>the servant of God</b>” as the Bible (NKJV) indicated… but to say he is BEGOTTEN son of God, it is a blasphemy of the highest order, because the word begotten means <b>to have sex and produce</b>, and if you read <b>YOUR BIBLE AGAIN</b> you will realize that this is what it means. <b>Mathew 1 </b> 1:1 The book of the generation of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham. 1:2 Abraham begat (<b>have sex and produce</b>) Isaac; and Isaac begat (<b>have sex and produce</b>) Jacob; and Jacob begat (<b>have sex and produce</b>) Judas and his brethren; 1:3 And Judas begat (<b>have sex and produce</b>) Phares and Zara of Thamar; and Phares begat (<b>have sex and produced</b>) Esrom; and.............. And on and on… according to the language of your book of God, <b>begotten means to have sex and produce</b>, no matter how hard you try to say that <i>this is not what it means</i> in the case of Jesus, then you should have used another term to describe the case. Plus the term <b>SON OF GOD</b> came form pagan Greek origin, so you should not be so proud of it. Also from Hebrew sources you can read: Quote:"In the Hebrew Bible Israel is both a man (Jacob, the son of Isaac) and the nation that descended from him. http://www.hebrew-streams.org/works/hebr...donai.html Clearly we can see that when Israel became God’s son, <b>he reached to the stage of being God’s servant</b>, and this is really what it means, not <i>BEGOTTEN.</i> Quote:It's not a matter of knowing the future Radiyah, I am speaking, according to your words here, about where you stand with Christ now. You're correct, no one knows the future, and perhaps Yahovah will give you repentance to the acknowledging of the truth (2nd Timothy 2:25,26). Can you show me a <b>SINGLE</b> verse in the entire New Testament where JEHOVAH’S name is mentioned? Since you are quoting the NT and using Jehovah’s name, then i would like to read his name ANYWHERE in the NT!!!! but let me save your time, because i've done my homework and here is the result... Quote:Verse Search Results (New International Version) CrossWalk.com Quote:While in your book, allah does not have a son, he begets not. So no, it is not simply the same God and a difference of belief. We have already established that SON means SERVANT so your God and ours is the same... not only that but YOUR FELLOW CHRISTIANS confirmed what am saying. Quote:Your book and my book teach two very different fundamental things. My Bible teaches that Salvation can only be obtained through Jesus Christ, who being God, took the form of a man, and was crucified for the sins of his sheep. I do not wish to pray to your god and offend my own. You say I am like the Najran Christians, I do not know who they were but if they did not turn from the truth that is Jesus Christ, then it sounds like good company to be in. All these issues we have dealt with before in which we have provided evidences Alhamdulelah that Jesus is not God, nor His "literal" son and that he did not die as the Christian thought... so no need to repeat the same stories again... this is just the invention of ONE branch of Christianity, but the fact is that there were MANY forms of CHRISTIANITIES after the departure of Jesus, and many of them do not support your beliefs, and YES they call themselves the TRUE CHRISTIANS. Salam Wael. |
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