Ask a Shia

[Karbala]

Good questions Muslimah. Let me break down your questions to make this simpler.

You and I being muslims are in agreement that our beloved Messenger, leader, and teacher prayer and peace be upon him and all other Prophets and Messengers never said thing out of his own desire. Nor did he marry out of his own desires, his marriages were all commanded by Allah.

So all Prophets never married out of their own desire.

Thus, he didnt attempt to those marriages out of his own personal choices for any manly or human desires. Those marriages were arranged by Allah Sobhanhu wa Taala.

Does this apply to all Prophets or just Mohammad(saw)? If it applies to all Prophets(SaW) then how would one explain the wives of Nuh and Lut (as).

[Hadji]

So all Prophets never married out of their own desire.

I think Muslimah was refering to:


"Your comrade erreth not, nor is deceived; Nor doth he speak of (his own) desire. It is naught save an inspiration that is inspired"


The Star 2-4


Also, even though I can't agree that all his marriages were all commanded by Allah (swt), I will agree that some of the marriages were commanded.


Either the case, Muslimah doesn't say anything about the other prophets being comanded to get married.


When asked about how valid is prayer without the Torbah, you said:

1. Not vaild for us.

Does that mean that the prayers of Ahlul Sunnah wal Jama'a is invalid? Or does it just mean that the torbah is just necessary for you folks?

The soil from Karbala is simply sacred to us, just as it was sacred to the Prophet(saw),

I'm not aware of this. Can you please provide me with one of your authentic hadeeths that establishes this. Also please provide the source of the hadeeth and the book that establishes the authenticity of this hadeeth.


I hope this isn't too much trouble. Thanks.

[Muslimah]

Bismillah


Jazakum Allah khairan Hadji, this is exactly what I meant regarding the marriages of our beloved teacher and Messenger Mohamed prayer and peace be upon him. Karbala, i think you did understand the point, however, for unknown reasons u decided to delay the reply.


Any way, I concur with Hajdi in requesting the hadeeth establishing Karbala as sacred. Although by simple reasoning, all the blood shed took part after the Messenger's death with a very long time. I understand that the Messenger salla Allah a`lyhee wa sallam did make a prophecy for example about the martyrdom of some companions while on Auhud mountain. Anyway, waiting for this hadeeth. Actually, this should be an essential point.


Again, I was refering to the marriages of the Mohamed prayer and peace be upon him, no need to waste time arguing about others like Noah and lut.

[Karbala]

Umm Salama says: I saw Husayn (a) sitting in the lap of his grandfather, the
Prophet (s), who had a red block of soil in his hand. The Prophet (s) was


kissing the dust and weeping. I asked him what that soil was. The Prophet


(s) said: "Gabriel has informed me that my son, this Husayn, will be


murdered in Iraq. He has brought this earth for me from that land. I am


weeping for the suffering that will befall my Husayn." Then the Prophet (s)


handed the dust to Umm Salama and said to her: "When you see this soil


turn into blood, you will know that my Husayn has been slaughtered." Umm


Salama kept the soil in a bottle and kept watch over it until she saw on the


day of Ashura, 10th of Muharram 61 A.H., that it turned to blood. Then she


knew that Husayn bin Ali (a) had been martyred.


[al-Hakim, al-Mustadrak, vol. 4, p. 398]


[al-Dhahabi, Siyar a`lam al-nubala', vol. 3, p. 194]


[ibn Kathir, al-Bidayah wa'l-nihayah, vol. 6, p. 230]


[al-Suyuti, Khasa'is al-kubra, vol. 2, p. 450; Jam` al-Jawami, vol. 1, p. 26]


[ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, Tahdhib al-tahdhib , vol. 2, p. 346]

Granted I have copied and pasted this from another website. But I really do not have time to find the originals.


Note the Prophet(Saw) kissed the dust from Karbala.

[Karbala]

Again, I was refering to the marriages of the Mohamed prayer and peace be upon him, no need to waste time arguing about others like Noah and lut.

Ok. I dont understand exactly what your question is then.

Does that mean that the prayers of Ahlul Sunnah wal Jama'a is invalid?

Life is about intentions. I do not judge whose prayers are invalid. But from a fiqhi point of view prostrating on anything other than earth or something grown from it is invalid.

[Hadji]

Umm Salama says: I saw Husayn (a) sitting in the lap of his grandfather, the
Prophet (s), who had a red block of soil in his hand. The Prophet (s) was


kissing the dust and weeping. I asked him what that soil was. The Prophet


(s) said: "Gabriel has informed me that my son, this Husayn, will be


murdered in Iraq. He has brought this earth for me from that land. I am


weeping for the suffering that will befall my Husayn." Then the Prophet (s)


handed the dust to Umm Salama and said to her: "When you see this soil


turn into blood, you will know that my Husayn has been slaughtered." Umm


Salama kept the soil in a bottle and kept watch over it until she saw on the


day of Ashura, 10th of Muharram 61 A.H., that it turned to blood. Then she


knew that Husayn bin Ali (a) had been martyred.


[al-Hakim, al-Mustadrak, vol. 4, p. 398]


[al-Dhahabi, Siyar a`lam al-nubala', vol. 3, p. 194]


[ibn Kathir, al-Bidayah wa'l-nihayah, vol. 6, p. 230]


[al-Suyuti, Khasa'is al-kubra, vol. 2, p. 450; Jam` al-Jawami, vol. 1, p. 26]


[ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, Tahdhib al-tahdhib , vol. 2, p. 346]

I was at a bookstore today and found a copy of Siyar A'laam Al-Nubala. I looked for the hadeeth online, but I could not find it. So I decided to make sure if this was authentic or not.


First of all, this part of the hadeeth doesn't exist:

Umm Salama kept the soil in a bottle and kept watch over it until she saw on the day of Ashura, 10th of Muharram 61 A.H., that it turned to blood. Then she knew that Husayn bin Ali (a) had been martyred.

This is not included in the hadeeth.

Note the Prophet(Saw) kissed the dust from Karbala.

That is also false. The hadeeth doesn't mention anything about the Prophet (pbuh) kissing the <i>turbah.</i> Yet, what it does say is that he was flipping it over.


It is very possible for whoever quoted it to make this mistake. The reason is that the two words look really similar in Arabic,


1- He flipped it over: Yu-qa-li-buha


2- He kissed it: Yu-qa-bi-luha


Adding onto that, the hadeeth is not even authentic. =p


---------


Anyways, Karbala, you didn't answer my question. When you mentioned that the <i>turbah</i> from Karbala is sacred, I replied with:

I'm not aware of this. Can you please provide me with one of <b>your</b> authentic hadeeths that establishes this. Also please provide the source of the hadeeth and the book that establishes the authenticity of this hadeeth.

Providing it from our sources is a stretch. I really doubt that it is something that can be established. That is why I ask you to provide it from <b>your</b> own sources.


Please don't forget the name of the book that establishes it's authenticity. Thanks.


By the way, I am willing to take pictures of the hadeeth in Siyar A'alaam Al Nubala if you have your doubts.

Granted I have copied and pasted this from another website.

I give your website a -1/10. =p

[Muslimah]

Bismillah


as salam alykom


Karbala,


<b>Again, I was refering to the marriages of the Mohamed prayer and peace be upon him, no need to waste time arguing about others like Noah and lut.</b>


Ok. I dont understand exactly what your question is then.


Seems you lost track Karbala, I dont blame you, my main question to which you responded by inquiring if I believe that all Messengers and prophets marriages are commanded by Allah including Noah and Lut.


Alright here is my original question that was put in post #219 (wow I cannt believe this):


<b>You and I being muslims are in agreement that our beloved Messenger, leader, and teacher prayer and peace be upon him and all other Prophets and Messengers never said thing out of his own desire. Nor did he marry out of his own desires, his marriages were all commanded by Allah. The marriage of Zainab Bint Jahash was even brought into an Ayah Mash a Allah, (may Allah Be Pleased with her), even mannersim of having food at his house, during Walima all was brought in Quran. Thus, he didnt attempt to those marriages out of his own personal choices for any manly or human desires. Those marriages were arranged by Allah Sobhanhu wa Taala. </b>


Under the previously mentioned, do you think for a momnet that Allah (astaghferullah) Would Make a decision that is incorrect? you think that Shia Ulema know better than Allah when they curse Abu Bakr and Omar at the beginning of their lessons. Those two who are the fathers of two of the Messenger's wives? You think Allah Would Accept for His Messenger prayer and peace be upon him to marrage daughters of not worthy men, or men who are described by a long list of bad adjectives???

[Muslimah]

Bismillah


I will let Hadji continue on the authenticity of the hadeeth, to me I use my reasoning, I dont believe the Messenger salla Allah a`lyhee wa sallam kissed it.


But anyway, now as u presented to me according to your belief how Karbala is sacred to you and all other shia? how sacred is sacred? I mean does this entail you performing Haj to Karbala? Also how far do you use Toqya when performing Haj to Kaaba???

[Muslimah]

Bismillah


I thought to help Hadji because actually he made a very good point on the possibility of making a mistake while copying:


http://www.al-eman.com/islamLib/viewchp.as...=251&CID=99#s12


This is a link to Beday wa Nihayah of Ibn Kateer, V. 6 Bab the murder of Hussain.


I know you are slow in reading Arabic Karbala, I will help Insh a Allah:


This is where u start reading:


الإخبار بمقتل الحسين بن علي رضي الله عنهما‏:


<b></b>




تربة حمراء وهو يقلِّبها


This is our core of interest.

[Hadji]

Mhmm... That's the same hadeeth that I found in Siyar A'alaam Al Nubala. I think I'm going to add that site to "Favorites". It seems to be very useful.