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reepicheep · 06-20-2006, 12:32 AM

> I can’t believe that Prophet Noah was "deceived"

> by drinking wine then lay NAKED.

Interesting comment. Are you saying that it is a crime, under Islamic law, for a person to be naked?

> That’s why wine or Alcohol is considered to be the MOTHER OF ALL EVIL.

Not according to the bible:

The love of money is the root of all evil. 1 Timothy 6:10

wel_mel_2 · 06-20-2006, 02:50 AM

Bismillah:

Quote:> I can’t believe that Prophet Noah was "deceived"
> by drinking wine then lay NAKED.

Interesting comment. Are you saying that it is a crime, under Islamic law, for a person to be naked?

Why did you escape the part of Prophet Lot? Drinking wine leads him to commit INCEST with his 2 daughters and both daughters became pregnant!! You tell me what would be the situation if he did not drink?

Coming to your question.

It is a crime according to Christianity and Islam to look on the nakedness of others. And you know well what happened after Prophet Noah DRINK WINE and became Naked, Ham's son was cursed because Ham saw the nakedness of his father and went and talked about it. Even Peter did not want Jesus to see him naked. So can you imagine if somebody saw the nakedness of a PRPHET OF GOD and went out to promote what he have seen. I believe God will keep the privacy of such holy people and not promote it Himself in His “Holy Book”.

It is interesting to mention that one verse of the Bible warn those who give their neighbor any drink so that you don’t see their nakedness:

Habakkuk2:15

Woe unto him that giveth his neighbour drink, that puttest thy bottle to him, and makest him drunken also, that thou mayest look on their nakedness! 

Naturally, drinking may lead you to do foolish things. So avoiding it is the solution since we are human and can very easily forget and wrong ourselves. The Qur’an rightly says:

5:90

O ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling, (dedication of) stones, and (divination by) arrows, are an abomination,- of Satan's handwork: eschew such (abomination), that ye may prosper.

FOR MORE “NAKED PROPHETS” IN THE BIBLE YOU MAY READ THE FOLLOWING VERSES:

'And he (Saul) stripped off his clothes also, and prophesied before Samuel in like manner, and lay down NAKED all that day and all that night Wherefore they say, Is Saul also among the prophets? " 1 SAMUEL 19:24

"How glorious was the king of Israel (David) to day, who UNCOVERED (became naked) himself to day in the eyes of the handmaids of his servants, as one of the vain fellows shamelessly UNCOVERS himself 2 SAMUEL 6:20

And the Lord said, like as my servant ISAIAH hath walked NAKED and barefoot three years . . . " . . young and old, NAKED and barefoot, even with their buttocks UNCOVERED, to the shame of Egypt. ISAIAH 20:3-4

Quote:> That’s why wine or Alcohol is considered to be the MOTHER OF ALL EVIL.
Not according to the bible:

This statement (Alcohol is the mother of all Evil) is one hadith of our beloved prophet PBUH. And it is true.

Salam

Wael.

reepicheep · 06-20-2006, 04:15 AM

> It is a crime according to Christianity and Islam to look

> on the nakedness of others.

This may be true for Islam, but it is certainly not true for Christianity.

wel_mel_2 · 06-20-2006, 05:17 AM

Quote:> It is a crime according to Christianity and Islam to look

> on the nakedness of others.

This may be true for Islam, but it is certainly not true for Christianity.

Huh??? i already show you the verses from your BIBLE.

Ham's son was cursed because Ham saw the nakedness of his father and went and talked about it read GENESIS 9-21

also.

Habakkuk2:15

Woe unto him that giveth his neighbour drink, that puttest thy bottle to him, and makest him drunken also, that thou mayest look on their nakedness! 

Salam

Wael

reepicheep · 06-20-2006, 07:52 AM

> Huh??? i already show you the verses from your BIBLE.

Nope, not what those passages are saying.

You say it is a crime, under Islamic law, for a person to see another person naked. What is the penalty, under Islamic law, for each of the following crimes?

(1) a parent sees a child naked

(2) a husband sees his wife naked

(3) a doctor sees his patient naked

(4) men see each other naked in the change room at a swimming pool

wel_mel_2 · 06-20-2006, 08:58 AM

Bismillah:

Quote:> Huh??? i already show you the verses from your BIBLE.
Nope, not what those passages are saying.

WHY NOT? Actually Habakkuk2:15 is sufficient enough to prove that it is wrong, sin, crime or something shameful or deplorable (SEE OXFORD DICTIONARY) TO LOOK TO YOUR NEIGHBOUR NAKEDNESS
. Of course this could apply to anyone else, not necessary your neighbor.

Quote:You say it is a crime, under Islamic law, for a person to see another person naked. What is the penalty, under Islamic law, for each of the following crimes?
(1) a parent sees a child naked

(2) a husband sees his wife naked

(3) a doctor sees his patient naked

(4) men see each other naked in the change room at a swimming pool

The first three points are excluded, and you know well that I was not talking about nakedness in that sense. I was talking about PROPHET Noah who gets DRUNK then he lay NAKED and ham was CURSED because he SAW HIM.

So according to the Bible the penalty of seeing people NAKED is CURSE. And I guess the Prophet Noah’s nakedness (in the Bible) is not matching with the above categories you have listed.

According to Islam man is not allowed to see another man naked or look at his private parts whether at swimming pool room or anywhere else. Likewise, woman is not allowed to see another woman naked or look at her private parts. and only God knows what would be the penalty for such sin.

God knows best.

Salam

Wae.

Curious Christian · 06-21-2006, 12:53 AM

Where does it say in the Qur'an that items 1-3 which Reep posted are excluded?

wel_mel_2 · 06-21-2006, 05:08 AM

Bismillah:

Quote:Where does it say in the Qur'an that items 1-3 which Reep posted are excluded?

ok here is what the Qur'an said:

Quote:(1) a parent sees a child naked

The Qur’an said: chapter 24 verse 31 And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons,
their husbands' sons
, their brothers or their brothers' sons, or their sisters' sons, or their women, or the slaves whom their right hands possess, or male servants free of physical needs, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex;
and that they should not strike their feet in order to draw attention to their hidden ornaments. And O ye Believers! turn ye all together towards Allah, that ye may attain Bliss.

since women could display her beauty infront of her sons and her husband's sons, then naturally she can also as a parent to clean or take shower for her young child in which will require for him to take off his or her garments.

Quote:(2) a husband sees his wife naked

in the Qur’an chapter 2 Verse 187 Allah describes the mutual relationship between spouses as “women are men’s cloths and men are women’s cloths. 

You may ask what clothes have to do with husbands and wives relationships. Well Clothes protect us from heat, cold, sun, dust etc… similarly spouses are protectors of each other.

Clothes also cover our defects and private parts. Similarly spouses know each other’s defects and are suppose to cover these defects and not to go around saying to anyone the weaknesses of their spouses.

Also clothes add to the beauty and charm of a person, similarly spouses add to each other’s beauty and charm, Phisically, they should be best dressed for each other and not for ceremonies only. For example, men are supposed to be sloppily dressed at home and vice versa.

And last but not list, cothes are the closest to our body, Similarly spouses are closest to each other and know each other’s secrets. They are GARMENTS to each others. Hope you understand this point.

Quote:(3) a doctor sees his patient naked

The Qur’an clearly state that we should seek the advise of an expert if we do not know. And since doctors are expert in the field of medicine, then there should be no problem if they ask us to take off our garments for check up or for surgery for example. Although it is preferable for a female patient to seek a female doctor advise but that is if available, same sex health care providers are encouraged but if not available and in life saving situations there should be no problem the Qur’an said: ask the people who knows best in particular field, or ask the people who have knowledge. I don’t have the reference now of this verse but I could provided insha’Allah if neccery for your research.

Salam.

Wael.

***Muslimah*** · 06-21-2006, 06:06 PM

Bismillah

salam all

No offense Wael, but how this thread turned into questions to Muslims???

:scratch:

It is getting totally off topic. Can we get back to where we were pls.

Of course for other ideas, pls do start a new thread

let us all observe this, btw, this is really for the benefit of members and guests. Visitors may come looking for something which may be under a thread by just mere chance and they cannt find it.

***Muslimah*** · 06-21-2006, 07:29 PM

Bismillah

Alright where were we,,,,,, O yes, what is the origin of the forms of worship in today's christianity. Specially, the iimage of Jesus being over the statue when this didnt take place except after his claimed death? why would you go and confess to a priest? who said that he owns the right to grant u forgiveness?

why would u make the cross sign over your chest to pray????

And more.

Let us get back to the topic and pls stay on topic.

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