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+--- Thread: Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? (/showthread.php?tid=7582)
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - AhmedBahgat - 09-09-2005
Quote:wooooahh i dont like people putting words in my mouth ...... did i say that ? i think i didnt .....i think u totally missed my point and misunderstood me .........all im saying is to make it "simple" is to not judge other peoples actions without knowing their situation fully .......thats my view .....i see we aint gonna get along so ill leave it at that ------WE SITTING IN OUR HOMES CANNOT DECIDE WOTS WRONG OR RIGHT ......and please dont tell me to strap myself with a bomb i find that quite offensive from where i come from .....
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ok brother sorry for that I thought that is what you are saying
but again there is not justification whatsoever for anyone to strap a bomb and kill the self and other inccoent people
but I still can't understand how we can't decide what is wrong and what is right by sitting at our homes, at least I know bombing the self and inncoent people is wrong and that is my decision to take as you also have your freewill to make your descision
and sorry again if you got offended by my sarcastic comment, as truely I met a lot of muslims who support this unhuman action while they sit at their homes watching TV, most should understand clearly what an equpied country is,and most also understand when a tyrant government is rulling any country. and I'm sure most understand why Islam and Arabs has been degraded that much
peace
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - Muslimah - 09-09-2005
Bismillah
as salam alykom brother Ahmed
Matter of fact, after making my post last evening, I wanted to add a commnet in which I almost agree with Suhail. In brief before I continue let us not sit down and judge without knowing the given circumstances of each case.
I might have put it on my first post, but not clear enough.
Most important is to never wish for our brothers and sisters to be eligible for this description on the Ayah. Let us pray they dont fit.
Brother as u said being Egyptian, for instance, and I will just take one example in order not to prolong the post and elaborate on the matter. The young man who carried out Taba operation, according to Egyptian media even, used to sit watching the news, getting frustrated over what is taking place in Palestine, seeing how the Muslim world is not doing anything, and get more frustrated.
By what he did, he felt that he fulfilled his duty before Allah in helping to defend a Muslim land.
Brother I think u have few points mixed up, such as Palestineans selling their land. They were forced to do so brother, I know this from Palestinean families living here.
Any way back to point, as for you calling Israelis (not jews) innocent, I think to the best of my knowledge, although there is a fatwa about it. But just take it logical. No woman there is a civilian. They are all military objects brother.
I will not elaborate on this since we dedicated many threads to this particular issue.
I can dig it for u later Insh a Allah.
As what is achieved thru martyrdom operations, much is achieved much. Enough that the enemy is not feeling secure anymore in the Muslim land which is the objective.
There is also a thread about this hold on let me dig it Insh a Allah:
http://www.islamsms.com/bb//index.php?...ic=1429&hl=pigs
I also know that Jews not only killed Prophets but also are inclined to breaking covenants.
The most important point is that we are not supposed to go around showing the world how peaceful our religion is. Our religion is combined of peace, Jihad and Qital. U r very right. Jihad is different from Qital. But as we also explained Islam is sometimes mistakenly explained as peace, which is not in Arabic it is totally different.
Islam is to submit, surrender,...etc to Allah and only Allah.
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - AhmedBahgat - 09-09-2005
Thank you sister, yeh let's leave that Arab/Israeli conflict aside, I do not like talking about it really, just one comment
regarding selling the land, well yes some might have been forced to sell it but many has sold it for the money, I know very well becaise my father was an ex army officer in Egypt who ent through 2 wars and he was the one that told me that
so if my enemy goes astray and kills innocent people, should I do the same and kill innocent people?
again I stress hard, a martyr can not decide to be one, it makes no sense
peace to all
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - Muslimah - 09-09-2005
Bismillah
as salam alykom brother Ahmed
You brought up an excellent point, a martyre is only known to Allah.
I mean a martyre in the battle field. No matter how brave one fights if the intention is not for Allah, then unfortunately he lost it.
O and welcome brother Ahmed ahlan wa sahlan sorry brothers and sisters for this arabic welcome to my fellow Egyptian. I think u r the only Egyptian member on this board beside me.
Although I just realized I want to get rid of this nationalism and make our identity Muslims [img]style_emoticons/default/smile.gif[/img]
Again we are looking forward for your input brother. [img]style_emoticons/default/smile.gif[/img]
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - Muslimah - 09-09-2005
Bismillah
as salam alykom
Sorry brother Ahmed but this issue is really important.
I am sure u r aware for example that the situation in Egypt has a very special local dimensions to it. I mean just one example, the masacre that was committed against a group of Japanese tourists in Dair Bahari was in retaliation against the police authorities who killed 7 young medical and engineering students who were all know of excellent manner.
No dont take this as an approval from me. But I just would like to highlight the fact that oppression is worse than murder.
It is a vicious circle brother. And that was just one example. Im sure u r aware of that.
Well at the end I will just quote again Zaghloul Annajar when he was interviewed after the London bombings. The anchor asked him how can Muslim countries fight this, he first told her there are no Muslim countries, then said, if they really want to. Let them teach Islam, spread correct knowledge, allow the youth access to proper Islam knowledge.
Brother we can differ in opinion but we will remain brothers and sisters.
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - Muslimah - 09-09-2005
Bismillah
Borther on a side note, you are not Ahmed Bahgat the infamous Egyptian businessman r u? [img]style_emoticons/default/smile.gif[/img]
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - AhmedBahgat - 09-09-2005
Thank you sister I appreciate the info you posted, I do believe what you siad sister, it is the ignornace of the Egyptians not to realize that it is about time to have another leader
at least we know that he stayed in power for 24 years and the conditiones hardly imroved, you see sister even before I finished my uni, i wanted to get out of this country, not because of the country rather because of its people ignorance,
No sister I'm not Ahmed Bahgat "the Business man in Egypt"
my fill name is Ahmed Fayez Bahgat
take care sister
may Allah bless Egypt
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - AhmedBahgat - 09-09-2005
Quote:Bismillah
as salam alykom brother Ahmed
You brought up an excellent point, a martyre is only known to Allah.
I mean a martyre in the battle field. No matter how brave one fights if the intention is not for Allah, then unfortunately he lost it.
O and welcome brother Ahmed ahlan wa sahlan sorry brothers and sisters for this arabic welcome to my fellow Egyptian. I think u r the only Egyptian member on this board beside me.
Although I just realized I want to get rid of this nationalism and make our identity Muslims [img]style_emoticons/default/smile.gif[/img]
Again we are looking forward for your input brother. [img]style_emoticons/default/smile.gif[/img]
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Thank you my dear fellow country woman, I'm glad I finally found a reasonable egyptian to discuss online very important issues that are killing me for years and years, regarding Islam and Arabs specificly the egyptians
regarding a martyr, exactly as you said it sister, for Allah Sabeel we go and fight the people who want to kill us because of our religion or kicked us from our homes , then if we get killed yet we can not know if we died martyrs, because It is only Allah that know if the fight was for "His Sabeel" "Al Lazeen Qottelo Fi Sabeel Allah", and because we can not know the others intensions for certain then we can not know that the person was really doing it for "Sabeel Allah"
in fact I will consider it a minor sin to call a dead human "Shaheed" or "Maghfoor Laho", this is non sense, because it is like we already know what Allah is doing with them for certain, and I'm sure we can not know the exact detalis for ourselves before we die about what will happen when we die, yet to know it about another person
I remember an authenticated hadith regarding a parable about a man who was doing plenty of good deeds and was a believer, when he was giving account to Allah, he told Allah I should go to the heaven due ti the many good deeds I did, Allah told the angels to take him and throw him in Hell, because he will only enter paradise with the blessing and mercy of Allah not because of his good deeds, we can not really know sister, who is Shaheed and who is Maghfoor Laho, we can only hope that our loved ones who died be treated as "Shaheed" or be blessed and forgiven then dealt with ease by Allah.
Take care sister
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - AhmedBahgat - 09-09-2005
Quote:Bismillah
as salam alykom
Sorry brother Ahmed but this issue is really important.
I am sure u r aware for example that the situation in Egypt has a very special local dimensions to it. I mean just one example, the masacre that was committed against a group of Japanese tourists in Dair Bahari was in retaliation against the police authorities who killed 7 young medical and engineering students who were all know of excellent manner.
No dont take this as an approval from me. But I just would like to highlight the fact that oppression is worse than murder.
It is a vicious circle brother. And that was just one example. Im sure u r aware of that.
Well at the end I will just quote again Zaghloul Annajar when he was interviewed after the London bombings. The anchor asked him how can Muslim countries fight this, he first told her there are no Muslim countries, then said, if they really want to. Let them teach Islam, spread correct knowledge, allow the youth access to proper Islam knowledge.
Brother we can differ in opinion but we will remain brothers and sisters.
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I agree sister, it is very important, in fact as far as I believe those people took Allah attension big times, He mention them in His book almost in the first page, while Allah took 4 verses to describe the believers(2:2-5), 2 verses to describe tthe unbelievers (2:6-7) and He described the Terrorists in a massive 13 verses with 2 parables to decribe them in these verses (2:8-20), how important that is for us then?, very important sister
it is affecting everything in the world and does no good to Islam, in fact Islam is the first victim, because we know anyone who does wrong they always try to justify their actions, even if it was a clear cut wrong, I may do that to, it is a human nature I reckon, so those people use the religion to justify their actions and by showing a very strong and misleading example of sacrifying the self, this sacrify will make it look to the non muslims as so genuine act in Islam, what a big lie sister, we muslims, our children, our grand children, will pay dearly for it if muslims do not take a stand and clear this issue to the world
however i agree sister that oppersion will make people go astray and think of revenge, but for me I see it as both parties has fell into satan trap, nothing more,
I will give you an example, we know in the Quran that anyone who was raised non muslim by his/her parents can not use this excuse with Allah, i.e. they can not say sorry we were just following our parents
the excuse sound very genuine to me, however, why Allah will not accept that excuse?, because simply He has given them brains and they were given a freewill to do what they want, they chose to ignore His warnings and follow their parnets "whom the Quran is very high on respecting and admiring them",
so I can not use the excuse that I was oppressed to go astray and kill a few inncoent people as well kill myself
but I can use the oppression excuse if I took my revenge from the perpetrators who oppressed me, not the innocent women and children
Take care sister
Does the Quran talks about the Terrorists? - AhmedBahgat - 09-10-2005
<b>Hadith Qudsi 6:</b>
On the authority of Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him), who said: I heard the Messenger of Allah (PBUH) say:
<b>The first of people against whom judgment will be pronounced on the Day of Resurrection will be a man who died a martyr
. </b>
He will be brought and Allah will make known to him His favours and he will recognize them. [ The Almighty] will say: And what did you do about them? He will say:<b> I fought for you until I died a martyr</b>. <b>He will say: You have lied - you did but fight that it might be said [of you]: He is courageous.
</b>
<b>And so it was said. Then he will be ordered to be dragged along on his face until he is cast into Hell-fire. </b>
[Another] will be a man who has studied [religious]knowledge and has taught it and who used to recite the Quran. He will be brought and Allah will make known to his His favours and he will recognize them. [The Almighty] will say: And what did you do about them? He will say: I studied [religious] knowledge and I taught it and I recited the Quran for Your sake. He will say: You have lied - you did but study [religious] knowledge that it might be said [of you]: He is learned. And you recited the Quran that it might be said [of you]: He is a reciter. And so it was said. Then he will be ordered to be dragged along on his face until he is cast into Hell-fire. [Another] will be a man whom Allah had made rich and to whom He had given all kinds of wealth. He will be brought and Allah will make known to his His favours and he will recognize them. [The Almighty] will say: And what did you do about them? He will say: I left no path [untrodden] in which You like money to be spent without spending in it for Your sake. He will say: You have lied - you did but do so that it might be said [of you]: He is open-handed. And so it was said. Then he will be ordered to be dragged along on his face until he is cast into Hell-fire.
<i><b>It was related by Muslim (also by at-Tirmidhi and an-Nasa'i). </b></i>