Forums
›
ENGLISH
›
"And remind for reminding benefit the believers
›
HIJAB - Give your input
Post Reply
Post Reply
| Thread Review (Newest First) |
| Posted by Muslimah - 07-05-2009, 08:06 PM |
|
Bismillah Sobhan Allah, reading and pondering on the Quran is an ongoing process of learning. Alhamdulelah. Again I would like to give more insight regarding the other Ayah ordaining Muslim women dress code. ----------------- <b>"O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (veils) all over their bodies (i.e.screen themselves completely except the eyes or one eye to see the way). That will be better, that they should be known (as free respectable women) so as not to be annoyed. And Allah is Ever Oft ¬Forgiving, Most Merciful." (Quran 33:59)</b> I was discussing the Muslim women dress code with an American woman and I quoted this Ayah and explained it to her as one of the purposes. In this Ayah, the purpose is introduced as to identify and differentiate between free and slave women. She replied, O then this dress code should not apply during our time. There is no slavery no more. I replied, let us think about it. It might be true that formal slavery (although still exist as human trafficking..etc) is not practiced anymore. But unfortunately, women enslave themselves voluntarily. In the normal situation, slavery is induced over women (or men) by virtue of many ways: war as captives, kidnapping, children of slaves..etc. These cases gave no choice for a woman to be but a slave of a monetary value. However, she only has one master who is supposed to take care of her in all aspects. Comparing with the current situation, a woman willingly enslaves herself for example when she chooses show business as a career. A dancer who performs over stage with 100s of eyes looking at her, paying for this performance, is doing nothing but voluntarily enslaving herself to all of them. Even worse, in cases of women who do not observe the dress code, they enslave themselves to others for free, they offer them free pleasure sometimes only in return for a praising word or a compliment, like O how pretty you are, or how pretty and elegant your wife is. This supposedly free woman who is even married is willingly enslaved to others. Do not we need this dress code to serve as an identity for us free women? Is not this a clear purpose why Allah ordained for us this code? Quran and Allah's Divine commands are never time limited, but they rather apply and shall continue to apply till the Day After. But we need to ponder, reason and understand as we are commanded by Quran in many positions, Allah Say: Do not they comprehend? Do they understand, or for those who ponder. May Allah Makes us among those who ponder and comprehend. Alhamdulelah Who Has Guided us for this and if it was not for Him we would not have been guided. |
| Posted by wel_mel_2 - 05-27-2007, 09:26 PM |
|
Bismillah: Assalamo ALikum. Quote:Yes... as opposed to, "In obedience to the Quran" or "Islam" or "Family" or "Culture" or "Society", etc. The idea of "that which is veiled is that which is holy" is scriptual & Catholic women who cover their heads do so in obedience to the written word of God not because of trivial reasons or rules outside of Cathoicism. I don’t actually care about your personal observation FHC, till this moment you cannot understand what Catholics themselves said about Hijab. So it seems to me that all of them are wrong and you are the only person recognized by the Catholic Church as true follower!!. Quote:Veiling is optional in Catholicism. Trust me on this one, Maybe, but in Christianity in general it is obligatory as I’ve shown you in several Christian websites. but in anyway, I don’t care about this either, i care about my own faith which clearly prescribed Hijab and makes it compulsory, and I think you got that long time ago. Salam Wael. |
| Posted by Faith Hope Charity - 05-26-2007, 01:30 PM |
|
Glory to God, peace on earth, good will to all. Hi Wael :) Quote:Please try to get rid of “<i>quoting out of context theory</i>”[/b] Oh I see! Your dilemma is in the interpretation not the context. Quote:the website clearly mentioned that <b>In obedience to Sacred Scripture, many Catholic women wear some kind of veil or headcovering</b> Yes... as opposed to, "In obedience to the Quran" or "Islam" or "Family" or "Culture" or "Society", etc. The idea of "that which is veiled is that which is holy" is scriptual & Catholic women who cover their heads do so in obedience to the written word of God not because of trivial reasons or rules outside of Cathoicism. Quote:in other words, since you are not covered according to your sacred scriptures, you are considered according to this website as disobedient to God and His scriptures. Looks like Judgement Day has arrived :lol: Quote:I am not picking and choosing FHC, it is you who cant see properly the clear message on this link. I've actually visited that website in the past & I quite like it. The guy who owns it seems very devout & respectful. He makes it clear that his ideas aren't binding (by the way I've never come across anything heretical on the site). Just thought you'd like to know that he provides a disclaimer on the main page of that section: <i>Please note that most of my theology writings are speculative, rather than dogmatic. Also, many of the ideas expressed on this site are a matter of pious disagreement among faithful Catholics.</i> Quote:Again, I am not interested in proving that Hijab in Islam is the same in Christianity by quoting what Christian websites says, but I am only showing you that at least <b>headcovering</b> is an obligatory in Christianity according to Christians themselves (along with the hijab of the heart). Veiling is optional in Catholicism. Trust me on this one, Pope Wael :D God bless. |
| Posted by Muslimah - 05-25-2007, 08:07 PM |
|
Bismillah As we already explained how the word Khimar is derived from the noun Khamirah which means yeast. To further explore the reason behind the certainly well chosen description by Allah The Best Sayer The Truth Sayer Who Used Khumurehen instead of Ghitaa. Actually in the Arabic language we call this Jazalet Al Lafz which means the speciality of the wording. In other words, this word can not be replaced – to serve this multiple meanings – with any other words. Come let us explore in case the word Ghitaa was used. Where did Allah Use Ghita`a? What does it convey of meanings? To do this I will just use one example that will convey the meaning and serve the purpose. “(To) those whose eyes had been under a covering from My Reminder (this Qur’ân), and who could not bear to hear (it).” (Quran 18:101) That reads in Arabic as follows: Allatheena kanat aAAyunuhum fee ghita-in AAan thikree wakanoo la yastateeAAoona samAAan. In this noble Ayah, Allah Used the word ghita to give the meaning of preventing communication, closing something, Allah symbolically used it to present a description of those who are absent minded from remembering Allah. The Ayah so elequoently saying that the eyes are covered in a way that prevents them from making dkhir. In other words, the eyes make dhikr of course by looking into Allah’s signs, reading Quran, looking around u, avoiding looking into Haram things. The core of interest here, what did the word ghita serve? It served a prevention of communication, closing, covering, veiling, obsecuring…etc. Thus, in case the same words was used to fully explain how a muslim woman should be dressed, this would have certainly transmitted the sense of covering the mind, veiling the mind, putting it into darkness, preventing her abilities from functioning and working, denying her a chance to develop and grow. Grow, this is what we are looking for. This what the word khimar as derived from Khamirah convey. Khamirah = yeast that plays a growth role like wise the khimar helps women to develop their mental capabilities. Sobhan Allah Who refuted an argument being made in the 21st century more than 1400 years ago, just by using only one word instead of another. And they say that Quran is not Divine. Allah u Akbar. |
| Posted by wel_mel_2 - 05-20-2007, 11:44 PM |
|
Bismillah: Assalamo ALikum. Quote:That is an EXCELLENT website! I highly recommend it! I just wish you wouldn't pick & chose quotes. You ned to read it all in context. It confirms my position perfectly. Since we're picking & choosing, I'll select my highlights :D Please try to get rid of “<i>quoting out of context theory</i>”, the website clearly mentioned that <b>In obedience to Sacred Scripture, many Catholic women wear some kind of veil or headcovering</b>, in other words, since you are not covered according to your sacred scriptures, you are considered according to this website as disobedient to God and His scriptures. I am not picking and choosing FHC, it is you who cant see properly the clear message on this link. Again, I am not interested in proving that Hijab in Islam is the same in Christianity by quoting what Christian websites says, but I am only showing you that at least <b>headcovering</b> is an obligatory in Christianity according to Christians themselves (along with the hijab of the heart). Salam Wael. |
| Posted by Muslimah - 05-20-2007, 12:21 PM |
|
Bismillah Praise be to Allah, King of the Worlds the All Knowledgeable and prayer and peace be upon His Messenger Mohamed and all other messengers and prophets. Insh a Allah in this post I will try to invest the blessing of being a native Aabic speaker and share how I do understand the Ayah of the dress code, however, I must say that Insh aAllah this is my personal interpretation and may Allah Forgive me if I m wrong. In Quran, there is an Ayah that stands as basis for women to adopt a certain dress code that entails covering their heads, shoulders and front part of their garments. The Ayah goes as follows: “And tell the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils all over Juyûbihinna and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband’s fathers, or their sons, or their husband’s sons, or their brothers or their brother’s sons, or their sister’s sons, or their (Muslim) women (i.e. their sisters in Islâm), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of feminine sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allâh to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful” (Quran 24:31) In this Ayah, Allah used the word Khumurehin (which is the underlined red font word in the translation above) to indicate the head cover rather than using the word <i>Ghitaa e roosekum </i> which translates as head cover. How do we understand it this way?? The word khumurehin is the plural of khimar. Khimar in Arabic is the item used to cover the top of anything. For instance, in Arabic we can say khamerel aneyah, meaning cover the top of the utensil. But at the same time, the word khamer is used to convey the sense of the yeast effect on dough. In other words, when we add yeast to the dough, the yeast works as a growth factor to the dough. Therefore, to have the yeast performs the expected role and introduces the needed effect of growth, the utensil must be covered after adding the yeast to the dough. Let us apply this on the incomparable meaningful expression of Allah. Allah Commanded women to use their khimars which would cover their heads but at the same time will allow them to attain growth of their intellectual, mental, and reasoning abilities. Allah The All Knowing, Knew ahead that there will be a strong argument even among muslim women in some cases that Hijab as they call it is synonymous to the veil of the mind, the ability of a woman to reason and think. However, Allah Willed to tell us no, in fact covering your heads will allow u the contrary. How is that?? When women are not abiding by the dress code, they lay more emphasis on their appearance and how to make an impact through this appearance. Even on the professional level, a woman spends much time before a formal meeting making a decision on which suit to wear, which color is more adequate for this particular gathering, which perfume shall be proper, what is the set of accessories that will go with the rest of items…etc. In this, she over uses her mind in how to make her appearance influential enough. But Allah Wills for the Muslim woman not to be busy or dependant on her appearance. When a Muslim woman covers her head, she allows the intellectual aspect to grow just as the yeast helps dough to grow. This is what Allah Desire for us. Look to the mothers of the believers how wise they were and they were even fully covered. Alhamdulelah Who Has Guided us for this and if it was not for Him we wouldnt have been guided. |
| Posted by Faith Hope Charity - 05-20-2007, 12:07 PM |
|
In the Name of the Father & of the Son & of the Holy Spirit - One God - now & forever. Amen. May the peace of Christ be with you! Wael, first of all I'd just like to thank you for spending so much time attending to my posts. It's not easy putting up with me, I know :) I admire you & consider you to be a friend. Okay! Enough with the mushy stuff :blush: let's get down to business!!! Quote:The reason for veiling is explained here from a catholic view point: That is an EXCELLENT website! I highly recommend it! I just wish you wouldn't pick & chose quotes. You ned to read it all in context. It confirms my position perfectly. Since we're picking & choosing, I'll select my highlights :D The moral law requires all women to wear the veil on their hearts. A woman should <b>not</b> wear the veil on her head, <b>until</b> she is wearing it first on her heart. (the author used bold not me) Women who wear the veil on their hearts are imitating the Virgin Mary in her humility, submissiveness, and obedience to Christ. The veil should cover her head, but not her face. It is first and foremost symbolic of humility, submissiveness and obedience. Wow! I'd like for nothing more than to reach for a veil & put it over my head right this instance but I don't feel as though I'm worthy enough for it. I love my religion so much & I know you love yours. Alhamdulilah! There's no point in comparing or competeing. Let's just try to be the best Catholics/Muslims we can be & pray for each other. May God bless all Muslims & Christians who strive to please God/Allah (SWT). |
| Posted by Faith Hope Charity - 05-20-2007, 11:52 AM |
|
In the Name of the Father & of the Son & of the Holy Spirit - One God - now & forever. Amen. May the peace of Christ be with you! Quote:Hijab is something that we are proud of as muslims. It gives us an identity that protects us from the surrounded world. Unfortunately, in our countries nowadays girls are using hijab in a wrong way and i wish that they will know one day the real meaning beyond hijab. For me, Hijab means covering urself and protect it from not only strangers but also protect urself from urself. It should be protecting u from talking about others, hurting others by any means, it gives u the feeling of being a real muslima. This is what happened with me. It made me struggle my inner self. Hijab made me protect myself from myself. Whenever i wear it when i go out it reminds me of being muslima and that i should respect my great identity. It made me more shy and respectful. I felt the respects in all people's eyes men and women. It gave me the opportunity to discuss myself more and more. This is hijab me, it's still cleaning me from the inside before the outside. I am proud of wearing it Thanks for sharing. That was a pleasant read. If hijab has made you happy & more virtuous than I would encourage you to keep hijabing from the bottom of my heart. Quote:You asked about the Islamic theology behind hijab, and the answer is to all the questions you raised are the following: Thanks :) I appreciate it! Quote:1. From Eve to Virgin Mary were believers in one God, in other words we called it in Islam "Taw7eed". All the messengers were believing in one God "Allah". This means that The word "Muslim" wasn't there at that time. Fair enough! But were they Muslims ("ones who submit") or not? I'm a little confused :confused_smile: Quote:2. According to my knowledge, Virgin Mary wore the veil, or let me say she covered her hair and here body. It is not like the veil "hijab" that we wear in Islam but it has the same concept i guess. I never denied the fact that Our Lady wore a veil. All I said is that "veiling" in Catholicism is VERY different from hiijab. Even the concept isn't the same. Also, the Blessed Virgin Mary is special. It was fitting for her to be veiled all over because she's the new "Ark of the Civenant" - a Holy Tabernacle that carried Divine Life within her (from the Catholic perspective). If you enter a Catholic Church you'll notice that the Holy Sacrament remains covered in the Tabernacle, behind a veil. Quote:3. The last religion on this earth is Islam and that doesn't mean that all the previous religions were wrong. Each religion was given by God to a certain group of people, but Islam was given to all human kinds. And you can get what I mean through reading the messengers stories. That's a whole other topic! For the interest of this thread I'll focus solely on the issue of hijab. Quote:5. The history of hijab begun when God wanted to make the Muslim women different than other women at that time of Jaheliya "before the presence of our Prophet (PBUH). Because when God gave us Islam, God gave us the speciality in everything. God was fair and wanted Muslims women to be more protected and more devoted to God and his prophet (PBUH). You may find what I am saying in the Holy Quraan surrat "Al-Noor" part 18, page 350. And also, it is found in the Quraan in other Surra but to be honest i don't remember it. Who or what is "Jaheliya"? So hijab began then? Does Allah (SWT) love Muslim women more that non-Muslim women? Is His love measured in Islam or is it infinite (as I've always thought it was)? Quote:You may find through this link the whole explanation for the whole Surra. Shukran for the Ayahs, Hadiths & link. I've come across them before. So I guess I'm correct in saying that hijab originated with Muhammad (PBUH) & was not meant for the "Muslims" prior to his message? Quote:I hope that I gave you a clear idea about why do God and his Prophet (PBUH) ordered Muslims women to wear Hijaab. I can't thank you enough! I'm extremely grateful. I hope we engage in further dialogue down the track. You're very helpful & sincere. May Allah (SWT) reward you for your efforts. Take care & God bless. |
| Posted by Faith Hope Charity - 05-20-2007, 11:33 AM |
|
In the Name of the Father & of the Son & of the Holy Spirit - One God - now & forever. Amen. May the peace of Christ be with you! Quote:women dress code was concurrent with the appearence of Mohamed prayer and peace be upon him, was his invention. Being part of our teachings, she wants to end up that Islam is, unlike we introduce, something invented at that time and was never the origin of all other religions which were distorted by the followers for their own desires. To be honest, I can't say I disagree with the above. I'm sure you understand. Quote:FHC, in this thread u kept bouncing back and forth between points and comments Im trying to keep up with Wael & his posts ;) Quote:Well you are not Muslim, Allah Shall not Judge you because you were uncovered, but for other reasons. why worry if you are not following an Islamic teaching? When it comes to hijab, I'm not concerned about God's judgement towards unhijabed men/women but the way they're judged by Muslims. Quote:As for us, dress code is clearly introduced in Quran, we have nothing to do with any other scripture, because Quran is enough for us. I don't have a problem with the way anyone dresses. I wish everybody felt the way I do. Thanks & God bless. |
| Posted by wel_mel_2 - 05-17-2007, 02:56 AM |
|
Bismillah: Assalamo Alikum. The reason for veiling is explained here from a catholic view point: Proper Dress and Behavior for Catholic Women Quote:In obedience to Sacred Scripture, many Catholic women wear some kind of veil or headcovering. Some wear a headcovering only at Mass. Others feel called to wear a headcovering at other times during the day, as well as at Mass. Many non-Catholic Christian women also wear a headcovering. Quote:Modesty in clothing is usually not difficult. <b>Clothing should not be too revealing or too tight. Women (as well as men) should not wear clothing which shows their undergarments.</b> This point compelled me to re post the 6 criteria for observing hijaab in Islam. 1. Extent: The first criterion is the extent of the body that should be covered. This is different for men and women. The extent of covering obligatory on the male is to cover the body at least from the navel to the knees. For women, the extent of covering obligatory is to cover the complete body except the face and the hands upto the wrist. If they wish to, they can cover even these parts of the body. Some scholars of Islam insist that the face and the hands are part of the obligatory extent of ‘hijaab’. All the remaining five criteria are the same for men and women. 2. The clothes worn should be loose and should not reveal the figure. 3. The clothes worn should not be transparent such that one can see through them. 4. The clothes worn should not be so glamorous as to attract the opposite sex. 5. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the opposite sex. 6. The clothes worn should not resemble that of the unbelievers i.e. they should not wear clothes that are specifically identities or symbols of the unbelievers’ religions. Quote:Modesty applies to behavior even more so than to clothing. God is more offended by someone who is modest in clothing but immodest in behavior, than He is by someone who is immodest in clothing but modest in behavior. Even so, <b>we should all be modest both in clothing and in behavior</b>. Same or similar to what I’ve said before that the complete hijaab, besides the six criteria of clothing, also includes the moral conduct, behaviour, attitude and intention of the individual. A person only fulfilling the criteria of hijaab of the clothes is observing ‘hijaab’ in a limited sense. Hijaab of the clothes should be accompanied by hijaab of the eyes, hijaab of the heart, ‘hijaab’ of thought and hijaab of intention. It also includes the way a person walks, the way a person talks, the way he behaves, etc. Quote:"<b>A woman shall not wear anything that pertains to a man, nor shall a man put on a woman's garment; for whoever does these things is an abomination to the LORD your God</b>." (Deut 22:5). The Prophet Muhammad pbuh also said: Allah curses those men who imitate the women, and He curses those women who imitate the men . [Al-Bukhari] I just found this website to be very interesting, so I thought to share it with our Catholic guests. Salam Wael. |
| This thread has more than 10 replies. Read the whole thread. |